Pete Hines Audio Interview

[Gwendo]

Which proves my point. You lack imagination. Did you play Daggerfall? Did you have a problem with the way guards 'knew' you had stolen, even though there were no guards visible at the time? Did you appreciate the clear intention of the developers that you should imagine that someone saw you, and alerted the guards?

Can you understand how that feature was there so that your sneak skill was actually relevant, and a thieving system could actually be implemented?

This just prooves that you have a flawed imagination, nothing more. I can see your imagination can't give me an answer to what I asked, but I'll comment your other example: when I enter a house with no NPC in there, I don't expect to be seen by someone. And even if so, I don't expect that that someone would be able to warn the guards in 0.03 seconds, so that they could appear in just 0.5 seconds after I stole the goods. Even with todays transport and comunication technology, we can't have that kind of response.

As you can see, I have a good imagination too, it's just not so flawed and colored by fanboyism like yours.

This is a different argument, which has nothing to do with the use-of-imagination point I was making. The merits of this decision are a different thing - a possible answer to your question: A good thief is not penalised. A good thief will establish links with fences. A bad thief just goes along to the nearest shop to sell off his loot, which will get him in trouble sooner or later.

Yeah. Just try to steal your friends' xbox and go sell it to those stores that buy second hand items. See how they know that the xbox was stolen. Hummm... Maybe some might ask for the receipts (for those who keep it after the warranty is expired)? Well, I guess in TES world, merchants don't use receipts.

 

[Twinfalls]

Oh dear, I'm dealing with a complete tard. I do wish some kind of warning could be given before wasting one's time - it's not always so clear form the outset.

Okay, Gwendo, happy Xboxing or whatever it is you do with yourself.

 

[Gwendo]

Humm... I guess I'm not the tard here, Twinfalls.
Now return to your imaginary world.

 

[Twinfalls]

Actually, despite your inability to understand the Daggerfall example, I will concede that merchants automatically not accepting stolen goods without explanation is a little bit daft - and may be rather annoying when playing.

My guess is the devs want to compel you to interact with the Thieves Guild if stealing stuff. It shouldn't be a huge leap of the imagination to deal with this, really, and going into the Thieves guild might add a bit of dealing-with-the-underworld atmosphere.

 

[yipsl]

He says their goal is 30 frames per second "everywhere." "It's a little challenging because we have so many different environments." "It's a challenge for us to get it absolutely everywhere."

Nice, the "uber-1337 n3xT G3nerashun graphixz0rz" game coming in at a pathetic 30 FPS. I got more than that in Counter-Strike with a TI4400, about 4 years ago.
.

Not that I'd ever defend Pete's overall marketing of this game, nothing personal to Pete, I don't know him. I just know the series and don't like the mainstream spin or some of the hand holding. What I will defend is framerates.

TES has never been about framerates. I recall Daggerfall getting about 16 fps on my new computer at the time and it didn't run smoothly till after patches and a couple of upgrades in the Pentium generation. So, I think 30 fps is fine and I can't see how comparison to any FPS makes a bit of sense.

As for guilds, they're leaving out the Nine Divines as a joinable faction, though plot reasons or alleged balance is completely unknown. Sometimes, I think their balance is how well it did in a poll of representative console gamers who were in diapers when many of us enjoyed our Commodore 64's or Laser 128 Apple II clones.

He mentioned four guilds, at other places, they've said six, but here's the caveat: the Arena Guild is really only half a guild and a homage to their original design for TES: Arena. Just go over to http://til.gamingsource.net/interviews/ ... rson.shtml and read that "He also said that he wanted someone who knew role-playing games and fantasy stuff for a game he had been trying to get made for a while called Arena, which was going to be a gladiatorial action game with some light role-playing elements."

The sixth guild is the secret Blades faction, which you can't deliver a package to and join right away this time around. So, the four guilds are Dark Brotherhood, Figthters, Mages and Thieves.

I really hate the marketing as "you can kill anyone" and I'm a softie for harmless NPCS in RPGs. I don't like the trend carried over from FPS or gangster games where players kill every NPC out of boredom or because they don't want to roleplay. If anyone wants to play a murderer, then that's what the DB is good for and even they would reign in a psychotic killer. That said, it seems to be a popular choice nowadays.

For me, TES will always be about "living another life", often as a picaresque adventurer who does not want to become the high mucky muck of every damned guild, but only to join the Nine Divines alone or the Mage's and Thieves Guild together.

 

[Xyber02]

With any combat skill? Come on, you have to realize that is lame. It's great for blunt weapons, but a blade should have a different effect, like bleeding.

There's this thing on swords. It's a kind of flat thing in between the sharp edges and pointy part. Yeah, I'm pretty sure that can be used to stun people. :wink:

 

[Shadow Aspect]

I'm not entirely sure if that's humourous or not
Anyway, I wouldn't like to belt someone across the head with the flat of a sword, can't imagine it would be very good for it.

 

[hiciacit]

They never had icons floating above their heads. The reticle in the center of the screen changes depending on what you're looking at (if you're within range to activate it). If it's an NPC you can talk to, the reticle has one appearance. If it's an essential NPC you can talk to, it has a different appearance. The reticle changes appearance when you look at a door, container, or item, as well. It's very small and unobtrusive.

I really don't see what all the fuss is about. A lot of RPGs differentiate between essential/important/irrelevant NPCs in obvious ways. Naming for instance, NPCs named 'Peasant' or 'Commonor' or whatever are not likely to be essential NPCs.

There are worse things to complain about with regards to Oblivion.

 

[Drakron]

As for guilds, they're leaving out the Nine Divines as a joinable faction, though plot reasons or alleged balance is completely unknown. Sometimes, I think their balance is how well it did in a poll of representative console gamers who were in diapers when many of us enjoyed our Commodore 64's or Laser 128 Apple II clones.
...

They are leaving for a reason, lack of time.

The nine divines are not a fraction, they are 9 fractions (since this is not Morrowind, the land of the Tribunal) and implementing 9 fraction quest lines would take considerable time.

Of course they are "balance" issues with so many skills taken out but still if mages can do it so can priests since there is little diference of both classes.

 

[Revasser]

As for guilds, they're leaving out the Nine Divines as a joinable faction, though plot reasons or alleged balance is completely unknown. Sometimes, I think their balance is how well it did in a poll of representative console gamers who were in diapers when many of us enjoyed our Commodore 64's or Laser 128 Apple II clones.
...

They are leaving for a reason, lack of time.

The nine divines are not a fraction, they are 9 fractions (since this is not Morrowind, the land of the Tribunal) and implementing 9 fraction quest lines would take considerable time.

Of course they are "balance" issues with so many skills taken out but still if mages can do it so can priests since there is little diference of both classes.

The Nine Dives is nine fractions? Which ones? 1/2, 4/7, 5/13? Are vulgar fractions allowed?

But yeah, you're probably right. It would take a lot of time, and we can't go missing that X360 launch date, now can we? Maybe we'll see them as a joinable faction in an expansion, although there are far too many things that are being relegated to "maybe in an expansion" or "just mod it", which is bullshit, really.

 

[kingcomrade]

om teh next halo iz gunna be on teh xbot306!! may b fianl fantssy 13!!

 

[Imbecile]

om teh next halo iz gunna be on teh xbot306!! may b fianl fantssy 13!!

I always find it amusing that "leetspeak" is impossible on consoles owing to the lack of keyboards. Guess its just a PC thing

 

[Drakron]

There are virtual keyboards that allow typing, I remenber that RE used then for typing passwords to access computers (damn, that was ages ago) and RE was a PS1 game.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

NPCs marked as essential (a status which can and does change) now go "unconscious" for a period of time, then get back up again.

I am Duncan MacCleod of the Clan MacCleod, and I am immortal.

You guys should have gotten Queen to do the soundtrack instead of Jeremy Soule.

 

[Atrokkus]

The unconcious solution is pretty weird, if you ask me. MSFD, you still haven't told us what happens to you and the npc you "killed" when he gets up? Is he like "Whoah, that was a fine brawl" and become friendly again? For instance, if I try to kill a king, what would happen?

Gothic had a much better approach. Yes, immortality might sound a little cheesy, but at least it's logical enough if there is no way to let that npc disappear altogehter, at least there is a logical response to your stupid action: you get thumped by this immortal one and his cronies but not to the death and then you either appologize or he just forgets. *BUT* if you did something utterly wrong or the npc was not very friendly, he could do the coup de grace, and good-bye cruel world for you.
It all looked and felt much natural in gothic, i dunno how it's going to turn out in Oblivion with your weird system.

 

[Drakron]

You guys should have gotten Queen to do the soundtrack instead of Jeremy Soule.

New Oblivion main theme!

When the outside temperature rises
And the meaning is oh so clear
One thousand and one yellow daffodils
Begin to dance in front of you - oh dear
Are they trying to tell you something
You're missing that one final screw
You're simply not in the pink my dear
To be honest you haven't got a clue

I'm going slightly mad
I'm going slightly mad
It finally happened - happened
It finally happened - ooh oh
It finally happened
I'm slightly mad
Oh dear

I'm one card short of a full deck
I'm not quite the shilling
One wave short of a shipwreck
I'm not my usual top billing
I'm coming down with a fever
I'm really out to sea
This kettle is boiling over
I think I'm a banana tree
Oh dear

I'm going slightly mad
I'm going slightly mad
It finally happened - happened
It finally happened - uh huh
It finally happened
I'm slightly mad
Oh dear

Ooh ooh ah ah
Ooh ooh ah ah
I'm knitting with only one needle
Unravelling fast it's true
I'm driving only three wheels these days
But my dear how about you

I'm going slightly mad
I'm going slightly mad
It finally happened
It finally happened - oh yes
It finally happened
I'm slightly mad
Just very slightly mad

And there you have it

 

[Doppelganger]

*applause*

 

[Xyber02]

I'm not entirely sure if that's humourous or not
Anyway, I wouldn't like to belt someone across the head with the flat of a sword, can't imagine it would be very good for it.

Well, since I'm pretty sure I wasn't using the techinical terms, humour was implied. I was just pointing out that it was entirely feasible that you can do more than make someone bleed with a sword.

 

[kastha]

Actually, despite your inability to understand the Daggerfall example, I will concede that merchants automatically not accepting stolen goods without explanation is a little bit daft - and may be rather annoying when playing.

My guess is the devs want to compel you to interact with the Thieves Guild if stealing stuff. It shouldn't be a huge leap of the imagination to deal with this, really, and going into the Thieves guild might add a bit of dealing-with-the-underworld atmosphere.

look, i may be a fanboy of bethesda, but you are clearly an idiot. this (your example of everyone miraculously knowing you did it, not giving you the opportunity to murder the wittness) was by far the most annoying thing about both morrowind AND daggerfal. just because the devs made it that way, doesnt mean it's the best way.

 

[yipsl]

As for guilds, they're leaving out the Nine Divines as a joinable faction, though plot reasons or alleged balance is completely unknown. Sometimes, I think their balance is how well it did in a poll of representative console gamers who were in diapers when many of us enjoyed our Commodore 64's or Laser 128 Apple II clones.
...

They are leaving for a reason, lack of time.

The nine divines are not a fraction, they are 9 fractions (since this is not Morrowind, the land of the Tribunal) and implementing 9 fraction quest lines would take considerable time.

Of course they are "balance" issues with so many skills taken out but still if mages can do it so can priests since there is little diference of both classes.

Though we all hoped for the Eight Divines as in Daggerfall (the "we" meaning old school TES gamers on the boards, including a few moderators) we got used to a combined Nine Divines as a sort of Imperial syncretism for development time sake. I never really expected the number of religious guilds as in Daggerfall, just that the sole religious guild would be joinable (is this where MSFD jumps in to say that I'm wrong because the Dark Brotherhood is joinable and they're a cult of Mephala? LOL).

In the first preview (Game Informer October 2004), the Nine Divines was listed as a joinable faction. By E3 it was not a joinable faction. They either changed the plot or had to ditch most of the quests related to joining to meet the Xbox 360 release date. I'm guessing it's the latter. They also listed the Arena as a joinable guild, then backpedelled the description as a sort of half guild. Lately, it's back to being listed among the joinable guilds and the (secret) Blades faction is the sixth.

My new signature over there has "Mages need mark and recall like monks need a melee staff". Consider it irony. The funny thing that's been going on there is the dismay by 360 gamers that they'll only get a promised 30 fps and not 60. They really didn't like it when people started posting links to tech discussions showing that the Power PC cores are less powerful than Athlon 64's or even P4's. Supposedly, games will use one core with two threads, one core will be used for sound and Xbox Live and the other isn't really used much yet. One claim is that it's really only twice as powerful as the mutant PIII 733 that was on the Xbox.

In a recent interview, Gavin sidestepped discussing what features they liked on the Xbox 360 CPU and discussed, instead, the power of the ATI GPU. Everything I've read says that the Xenon is lame compared to PCs, but the R500 is quite good.

Yes, Queen would be better than Jeremy Soule. After hearing his latest, it's the Daggerfall remixed MP3s for me. The only thing I liked in Morrowind was the main theme and I don't like the main theme to Oblivion. It's not just that I'm so Daggerfallish, but that I haven't heard any Jeremy Soule that appeals to me.

edited to say: My new sig there actually says: "A mage without mark and recall is like a monk without a melee staff." Whether the irony works remains to be seen. Let's hope both are in a commercial expansion.

Anyone else going to wait to play Oblivion until after Holidays are available as a download?

 

[Drakron]

Well I am happy with that decision, making eight fraction is the way to handle things, not making a half assed "cleric fraction".

Ridding is a example of a ffeature thrown in "for the heck of it" without any real use.

I am rather concerned about the direction of TES lore when they made the whole "Gates of Hell" idiocy since Oblivion is not hell, its the location were Daedra live and I rather they dont touch on things they cannot do justice that try to come up with something and it comming half assed.

 

[Mech]

Actually, despite your inability to understand the Daggerfall example, I will concede that merchants automatically not accepting stolen goods without explanation is a little bit daft - and may be rather annoying when playing.

My guess is the devs want to compel you to interact with the Thieves Guild if stealing stuff. It shouldn't be a huge leap of the imagination to deal with this, really, and going into the Thieves guild might add a bit of dealing-with-the-underworld atmosphere.

look, i may be a fanboy of bethesda, but you are clearly an idiot. this (your example of everyone miraculously knowing you did it, not giving you the opportunity to murder the wittness) was by far the most annoying thing about both morrowind AND daggerfal. just because the devs made it that way, doesnt mean it's the best way.

He didn't say it was the best way, even said it was a little daft. What he did say, if you would have opened your fucking eyes and read his post, was that this allows the developers to force the player to interact witht he Thieves Guild which really isn't that bad of an idea.

 

[Atrokkus]

For me, TES will always be about "living another life", often as a picaresque adventurer who does not want to become the high mucky muck of every damned guild, but only to join the Nine Divines alone or the Mage's and Thieves Guild together.

One of Morrowind's numerous flaws was the guild system. They were boring and totally not immersive. I never felt being part of the guild. I mean, look at them: simple linear quest-progression, with almost no intrigues, and this feeling of joining guilds just for the process of joining, just to put a mark in a long list of your uber-char's phat accomplishments. Damn, you could join almost all the guilds at once and be a guildmaster in them! This is absurd.
So I don't really care about the quantity of the guilds. Here I would choose quality over quanitity: make a few guilds, but make them *different* and *interesting* to be part of!

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

I still like the idea of quality implimentations of what status does in a guild and using random quest generation job boards. That way, your rank will allow you to control some actions of the guild in a fairly hand crafted manor while giving the player control of what shitty quests they can pick from. Let's face it, the hand done quests for the guilds in Morrowind were shit anyway, at least with a random quest generated job board, you'd be able to pick which shitty quest you wanted to do and they'd be different each day you read the board. Part of the control scheme could be that you can then assign lower pissants to those jobs and get a cut of the earnings for just being in a position of power. Hell, that would be an easy thing to impliment.

Not to mention guild rank should allow you to pick up lower ranked henchmen to help you out. There's no point in being in a fighter guild where you're always off on your own doing some crappy quest for a rank which is ultimately meaningless.

 

[kastha]

Actually, despite your inability to understand the Daggerfall example, I will concede that merchants automatically not accepting stolen goods without explanation is a little bit daft - and may be rather annoying when playing.

My guess is the devs want to compel you to interact with the Thieves Guild if stealing stuff. It shouldn't be a huge leap of the imagination to deal with this, really, and going into the Thieves guild might add a bit of dealing-with-the-underworld atmosphere.

look, i may be a fanboy of bethesda, but you are clearly an idiot. this (your example of everyone miraculously knowing you did it, not giving you the opportunity to murder the wittness) was by far the most annoying thing about both morrowind AND daggerfal. just because the devs made it that way, doesnt mean it's the best way.

He didn't say it was the best way, even said it was a little daft. What he did say, if you would have opened your fucking eyes and read his post, was that this allows the developers to force the player to interact witht he Thieves Guild which really isn't that bad of an idea.

see, you went a ruined a perfectly good flame! idiot.