Decline Enemies should react to being hit

[Iucounu]

irl a rifle shot would likely stop someone in their tracks completely and they'd fall down, but that would be no fun in most gamey contexts, where you want the encounter to last for at least a few rounds of mutual shin-kicking before one of you falls over.

This only applies when there's a single enemy. In original Ghost Recon, killing a single enemy is easy, the hard part is avoiding being killed by their alerted mates afterwards...

Which means that visible injuries can never be fully realistic but only look a lot less than the realistic look would be (if that makes sense).

I'd say there can be a difference between visible injury and the character's fighting ability. Many movies characters keep fighting no matter how much they bleed and/or get hit, but you do see them bleed or get hit in the movie. The same can be done in games. You can also let an injured game enemy become more dangerous if he "realizes" he's losing the fight and might as well try a suicidal run.

 

[Machocruz]

My thoughts went to Mike Tyson's Punch Out! and you can make him flinch with every hit, yet he can recover and knock your ass out instantly, because he's Mike Tyson. Again, how that would work with shooting a giant terminator skeleton boss with your M16 I'm not sure, unless we're saying those kinds of boss fights or games shouldn't be made anymore.

 

[gurugeorge]

irl a rifle shot would likely stop someone in their tracks completely and they'd fall down, but that would be no fun in most gamey contexts, where you want the encounter to last for at least a few rounds of mutual shin-kicking before one of you falls over.

This only applies when there's a single enemy. In original Ghost Recon, killing a single enemy is easy, the hard part is avoiding being killed by their alerted mates afterwards...

Which means that visible injuries can never be fully realistic but only look a lot less than the realistic look would be (if that makes sense).

I'd say there can be a difference between visible injury and the character's fighting ability. Many movies characters keep fighting no matter how much they bleed and/or get hit, but you do see them bleed or get hit in the movie. The same can be done in games. You can also let an injured game enemy become more dangerous if he "realizes" he's losing the fight and might as well try a suicidal run.

I'm sure many of us would love to see that, but I guess there's not much return for devs to implement that.

I suppose unless the selling point is something like, "no feedback in this game via numbers/abstractions, you literally see the damage you're doing."

 

[Ash]

unless we're saying those kinds of boss fights or games shouldn't be made anymore.

That is often the seeming end goal of many realismfaggots, because they don't think things through. Every game would be just like reality, maybe with a couple supernatural elements tacked-on ONLY if the setting and story allowed it. Anything "gamey" AKA actual game design and abstraction discarded. YAY!

Some realism faggotry can be fine, but there must always be a balance, and not every game needs to adhere to any realism at all.

 

[Iucounu]

irl a rifle shot would likely stop someone in their tracks completely and they'd fall down, but that would be no fun in most gamey contexts, where you want the encounter to last for at least a few rounds of mutual shin-kicking before one of you falls over.

This only applies when there's a single enemy. In original Ghost Recon, killing a single enemy is easy, the hard part is avoiding being killed by their alerted mates afterwards...

Which means that visible injuries can never be fully realistic but only look a lot less than the realistic look would be (if that makes sense).

I'd say there can be a difference between visible injury and the character's fighting ability. Many movies characters keep fighting no matter how much they bleed and/or get hit, but you do see them bleed or get hit in the movie. The same can be done in games. You can also let an injured game enemy become more dangerous if he "realizes" he's losing the fight and might as well try a suicidal run.

I'm sure many of us would love to see that, but I guess there's not much return for devs to implement that.

I suppose unless the selling point is something like, "no feedback in this game via numbers/abstractions, you literally see the damage you're doing."

It shouldn't even need to be a selling point, but the bare minimum. Numbers and enemy health bars cheapen many games.

Enemy health bars also affect gameplay negatively, by making me the player watch those bars (to see how much health the enemy has left) instead of focusing on what the actual enemy character is doing. Indeed, maybe the real use of numbers and enemy health bars is to distract you from noticing how primitive the fighting gameplay really is?

 

[Poseidon00]

The most recent UFC fighting games have actual reactions on hit that matter and seem reasonable, as opposed to the ever present "float your opponent while they lay horizontal and punch their feet for a combo" that is the plague of virtually every major 2d fighting game franchise

 

[Hell Swarm]

The most recent UFC fighting games have actual reactions on hit that matter and seem reasonable, as opposed to the ever present "float your opponent while they lay horizontal and punch their feet for a combo" that is the plague of virtually every major 2d fighting game franchise

Is it worth playing though?

Air juggles and wall carries can go suck a dick. Fuck modern fighting games made for losers wanting to play DDR without moving their legs

 

[Poseidon00]

The most recent UFC fighting games have actual reactions on hit that matter and seem reasonable, as opposed to the ever present "float your opponent while they lay horizontal and punch their feet for a combo" that is the plague of virtually every major 2d fighting game franchise

Is it worth playing though?

Air juggles and wall carries can go suck a dick. Fuck modern fighting games made for losers wanting to play DDR without moving their legs

The gameplay itself is decently fun, yeah. But half the reason I play fighters is because I like the setting and characters, so I want a fighting game I care about to have gameplay like that, then we are really talking. There's no reason a sword-based combat game can't have great hit detection, reactions that feel solid and change based on the power of the move, ways to interrupt or knock down by targeting a certain part during a certain time (like hitting the leg when one is up in the air), etc. Bushido Blade was a very early attempt at this!

 

[Hell Swarm]

Bushido blade was awesome

 

[BrainMuncher]

Sawyer saying animation is too hard

Since you're trying to move the goal posts lets remember what this was actually about:

You are a game designer. You decide what is and isn't a stun lock. Both player and enemies should react to being hit. It shouldn't mean stun locks.

If a character is flinching then it can't do anything else. In kotor/nwn characters will actually lose attacks the rules say they should have because of the combat animations playing out. In NWN2 Obsidian decided to just give ghost attacks with no animation attached to compensate for this. Can't do this in an action game.

Complaining that something is too hard or time consuming and blaming your tools is completely different from saying it can't be done. It can, has, and will be done. As Hell Swarm rightly said, the developer decides what is and isn't a stun lock. It doesn't have have to be super expensive either, can be basic animation cancelling like fighting games. Or they could be queued with a speedup so they still fit in the same amount of time.

Saying it can't be done is indefensible, I don't know why you're trying.

 

[Poseidon00]

Bushido blade was awesome

I had a Final Fantasy 7/Bushido Blade demo disc combo for the PS1 as a little kid. totally shaped my taste in games in hindsight. rpgs and fighters are the vast majority of what i end up playing.

 

[Hell Swarm]

Bushido blade was awesome

I had a Final Fantasy 7/Bushido Blade demo disc combo for the PS1 as a little kid. totally shaped my taste in games in hindsight. rpgs and fighters are the vast majority of what i end up playing.

I can't remember the demo disc I played it on. I did recently finish it on emulation. It's such a good concept and never really expanded on. I know there's some modern youtuber meme game but I've not tried it.