Pretti! Interface-graphics

[galsiah]

Marsal:
While totally ignoring VD and heading in the other direction is a novel strategy, it might not make too much sense.

It does look cluttered at first, but overall the style, the stones of different shapes and sizes, the lion head, even the big-ass HP/AP indicators work very well together and create a dark, gritty, primal interface.

I think your latest versions (though good) lose that "dark, gritty, primal" feel. The aim isn't romanesque culture at its height, but rather after it's been kicked in the teeth and left to rot. The latest iteration looks a little too neat to me.

(Also, personally I'd rather see more art and fewer letters - I don't particularly see a need for HP/AP, or INV. All three are missed opportunities to use something more stylish IMO. There again VD seems to like the letters - but what does he know? )

 

[OlSheep]

I think the columns look better without the odd vertical line (just a thought)...

I´m sorry, but I can´t see that line... Unless you meant horizontal...

In blue:



Might just be my monitor. I'm using my laptop right now and it's kinda crappy.

 

[Elhoim]

Character Screen RC1:



OlSheep: You are kinda detallist, aren´t you? I´ll see what I can do, but for me it´s barely visible.

 

[OlSheep]

You are kinda detallist, aren´t you? I´ll see what I can do, but for me it´s barely visible.

Yea... Well, as I've said, my laptop's screen just isn't good. It's too bright and not contrasting enough. So that vertical line stands out quite a lot here.

But, yeah, it's just a detail.

 

[Elhoim]

Yeah, that must be it, because I practically don´t see it. But if I get to do the UI, I promise I´ll remove it. Right now I can´t because of PS reasons.

 

[Vault Dweller]

The character screen looks great, Elhoim.

 

[galsiah]

Not that it's particularly important, but I think the vertical line would work better if it weren't quite so close the the edge of the visible area of the pillar. At present it's possible to think it's some sort of error (though it doesn't look that way to me, I can see that it could). If it were closer to the centre of the pillar, it'd be clear that this was an imperfection in the structure of the pillar - not an imperfection in the artwork.

That said, I really don't care either way .

 

[Elhoim]

Tell me what you think of this suggestions and in some cases (2-4-6) give a possible solution if you can:

Main Gui:

1-With regard to your HP/AP symbols, there really is very little reason to make them readable. They need to look good - not be readable. The number gives the player the information he requires - that is what needs legibility. After the first few minutes of the game, no player cares about legibility of the HP/AP symbols.

2-The icons blend in too much with the background marble.

3- I think the outline of the weapon slot and HP/AP numbers looks like a random scribbly line, not like something that was carved out of marble.

4- Yes, we all know it's a game. However, there's much talk of roman themes and egyptian themes -
sticking a computer disk in there doesn't help.

5- I think the columns look better without the odd vertical line (just a thought)...

All Screens:

6- Elhoim, I love the buttons in the crafting screen, but I'm not convinced with the background color. Looks like mud imo.

 

[Whipporowill]

You guys are using waaay to much texture backgrounds, my eyes are starting to water - and considering the UI is what you'll be hanging out with for a full game - go with something less obtuse than veined marble. Plain coloured backgrounds if it shows an item FFS!

 

[Hazelnut]

Tell me what you think of this suggestions and in some cases (2-4-6) give a possible solution if you can:

Main Gui:

1-With regard to your HP/AP symbols, there really is very little reason to make them readable. They need to look good - not be readable. The number gives the player the information he requires - that is what needs legibility. After the first few minutes of the game, no player cares about legibility of the HP/AP symbols.

I love them like you've got them in RC1 - raised with a yellow/gold tint. (and I think the same technique would look good for some of the text on the other screens, as I said in my last post: "I suggest using the same hint of yellow/gold that you're using on the HP/AP text on the capitalised heading and button words on that last screenshot Elhoim.")

2-The icons blend in too much with the background marble.

I think they're fine except for possibly 2,5 & 6 (from left) that could mabe be a little bulkier/bigger/more colourful because there's not enough to them to stand out. The others are all lovely IMO.

3- I think the outline of the weapon slot and HP/AP numbers looks like a random scribbly line, not like something that was carved out of marble.

I think an earlier version had less random 'carved by a drunk' lines, e.g. untitled2sx9.jpg, which looks better for the weapon slots. I think the lines for the numbers are better not quite so square - so stick with RC1 for those IMO.

4- Yes, we all know it's a game. However, there's much talk of roman themes and egyptian themes - sticking a computer disk in there doesn't help.

I think it looks really nice, but I do agree that it might be better to go and give a less cramped layout for the remaining buttons. I don't care enough either way - it certainly doesn't stick out like a sore thumb to me.

5- I think the columns look better without the odd vertical line (just a thought)...

I noticed these when cutting and pasting my suggestion at x2 zoom, but they're pretty unnoticable normally on the screens I've been using. Where did they come from? Did you draw the columns or lift them? They are a little odd, but not important IMO.

All Screens:

6- Elhoim, I love the buttons in the crafting screen, but I'm not convinced with the background color. Looks like mud imo.

Yeah the brown does get a little much when covering so much of the screen. I suggest experimenting with darker shades when covering the whole screen, maybe with slightly higher texture contrast (you are using a texture aren't you?) and if really good then maybe also use it in the lower left text window.

Just my 2p.. as someone who knows bugger all about visual design. Great work though!

 

[galsiah]

1-Genius. Or garbage. One of the two.

2-Perhaps having the background to the icon section in shadow would work - you'd get more contrast. As though the light were coming from above, and the horizontal border were shading the icon background (but not the icons themselves, clearly).
Just a thought - perhaps that'd look stupid.
Alternatively you could replace the outlines around the icons, but you might get that "pressed into clay" look if you're not careful. Perhaps deep and sharp, but not wide, outlines?

3-I think they should be a little straighter. At the moment they don't give the impression that the carver was even trying to carve straight. Clearly they shouldn't be dead straight if you're going for that effect, but they ought to look like they guy was making an effort.

4- I'd like to know what people think on this too though. To me the save icon seems a pointless distraction. Do any other RPGs have such an icon with other gameplay related ones? I can't think of any.

5- See above, but I don't care either way.

6-I'm not mad about that color, but I don't find it offputting either - it's perfectly fine IMO. Perhaps you could show a few alternatives and see what people think. I've no particular suggestion.

 

[OlSheep]

My two cents...

1-With regard to your HP/AP symbols, there really is very little reason to make them readable. They need to look good - not be readable. The number gives the player the information he requires - that is what needs legibility. After the first few minutes of the game, no player cares about legibility of the HP/AP symbols.
It's true. But then again if everything blends in too much, the UI becomes painful to look at. Just rasterize the layers you've used to write HP and/or AP and increase the contrast a bit? Or darken the effect you're using on the letters, that might work too.

2-The icons blend in too much with the background marble.
Just darken/widen the emboss effect a little bit.

3- I think the outline of the weapon slot and HP/AP numbers looks like a random scribbly line, not like something that was carved out of marble.
Lighten and widen the effect a bit.

4- Yes, we all know it's a game. However, there's much talk of roman themes and egyptian themes - sticking a computer disk in there doesn't help.
Unimportant, that's just wasting valuable time. A disk is a good metaphor for what the icon does which is good for the UI's usability. I think that's the kind of nitpick that won't bother anyone anymore after a few minutes of playing the game.

5- I think the columns look better without the odd vertical line (just a thought)...
Hahahaha

6- Elhoim, I love the buttons in the crafting screen, but I'm not convinced with the background color. Looks like mud imo.
Looks alright to me. I don't think it's possible to create a dark, marble-like area which is suitable for white text. Even if it actually was mud, I think it's still an acceptable compromise for readability...

 

[denizsi]

Is it totally out of question to have a custom interface in AoD, once the final design, layout (regarding placement of icons etc.) has been settled? Because, as it looks now, Elhoim's interface seems to be wider in favour so far and I prefer the default interface over it anyday. The same goes for other people, who didn't like the other interfaces.

 

[ixg]

A suggestion for a minimal interface:

Tried to get something unobtrusive and simple that blends in ok with the game.

 

[galsiah]

Unimportant, that's just wasting valuable time. A disk is a good metaphor for what the icon does which is good for the UI's usability. I think that's the kind of nitpick that won't bother anyone anymore after a few minutes of playing the game.

Even with my artistic skills, I could handle removing an icon.

The point isn't to replace the picture of the disk. It's to remove the button from the interface altogether. If it's really useful it should stay. If not it should go. You shouldn't need a reason to get rid of it beyond "It serves no purpose, takes up space, and has a negative impact (if anything) on the interface theme."

If it really does serve a useful purpose, then fine. That's the only reason to keep it though. Again, by "it" I mean the entire button - not the icon image.

 

[denizsi]

I really like the texture and the feel of it, ixg.

Again, by "it" I mean the entire button - not the icon image.

I still see the having the button as useful. Obivously, one can play the game using only a mouse entirely. So you can put away your keyboard, have some food and drink maybe in front of you and just the mouse. Or maybe I simply don't want to reach for the keyboard at all (god forbid I take some effort to make use of my mucles, arm, fingers). I'm only against having it as an interface element right next to other stuff.

 

[OlSheep]

A suggestion for a minimal interface:

[pic]

Tried to get something unobtrusive and simple that blends in ok with the game.

I like it (not that it matters ), it's clean and it kinda maximizes usability too. It misses a box for the text (IIRC, the engine isn't too flexible when it comes to font so the outlining effect that's been used to insure the text would be readable on both a light and dark background wouldn't work) and a way to see what's in the other hand though...

 

[Astromarine]

put the save/load function in the ESC menu where it belongs.

 

[Fryjar]

Great work Elhoim.
Although all of the other interfaces are true pieces of art, I'd go with Elhoims take on it.

Personally, I think that there are still a few things to improve about the other interface screens especially when it come to the brownish interface colour.
You should really consider altering this one, since right now, it doesn't really look all that appealing, except for the nice banners.
So maybe you should go with a lighter colour, more remniscent of the ones of your Hp/Aps letters or maybe one of your old ingame gui colours.
Additionally these screens (excpet for the gui which is nearly perfect for me, aside from the brown) should probably be decorated a bit more at the edges and corners, since right now, it really looks a bit bland.
Once again the banners are a good start but at the crafting screen (on all edges) and especially the upper right corner of the answer box should have some kind of enrichments, that make the screen more easy on the eyes.

 

[Elhoim]

About the disk, is it only for save or it opens the menu?

Personally, I think that there are still a few things to improve about the other interface screens especially when it come to the brownish interface colour.
You should really consider altering this one, since right now, it doesn't really look all that appealing, except for the nice banners.
So maybe you should go with a lighter colour, more remniscent of the ones of your Hp/Aps letters or maybe one of your old ingame gui colours.
Additionally these screens (excpet for the gui which is nearly perfect for me, aside from the brown) should probably be decorated a bit more at the edges and corners, since right now, it really looks a bit bland.
Once again the banners are a good start but at the crafting screen (on all edges) and especially the upper right corner of the answer box should have some kind of enrichments, that make the screen more easy on the eyes.

I will.

 

[Elhoim]

Main GUI RC2:

- Carved the HP/AP, while maintaining the color.
- Hired a better crafstman, who straightened the lines in the weapon slots.
- Made the icons clearer.
- Cleared the background of the numbers a little.

 

[OlSheep]

The point isn't to replace the picture of the disk. It's to remove the button from the interface altogether. If it's really useful it should stay. If not it should go. You shouldn't need a reason to get rid of it beyond "It serves no purpose, takes up space, and has a negative impact (if anything) on the interface theme."

If it really does serve a useful purpose, then fine. That's the only reason to keep it though. Again, by "it" I mean the entire button - not the icon image.

You're right, if it's completely useless it should go.

But I think that this decision goes to the game designer.

I still think that the impact on the UI's theme is minimal. I like to think that the best interface is the most functional, not the most astounding piece of art.

If I remember the course I've taken on Human-Machine Interface, only 10% of a software's value on the market is based on its look. 40% on its usability and 50% on how well the code actually runs.

[edit]: Obviously these stats aren't right for a game but you still get the big idea here.

A save button is a nice way not to force me to learn the keystroke to quicksave...

[edit2]: Ever played Ultima 8? I had metric fuckton of fun quicksaving instead of quickloading after the avatar had died by falling in a shitty pool in front of someone's house.

 

[galsiah]

I like to think that the best interface is the most functional, not the most astounding piece of art.

Agreed, but the last 15 pages are almost exclusively about art, not function. Also, I don't think removing the button does harm functionality.

Obviously these stats aren't right for a game but you still get the big idea here.

...that statistics are 90% about proving a point and 10% about relevance?

A save button is a nice way not to force me to learn the keystroke to quicksave...

I do hope you're not serious.
denizsi's "My keyboard is lost" standpoint at least is somewhat reasonable (presuming the save icon opens the menu, rather than directly saving - in which case you'd need the keyboard to load in any case).

"learning" a save key takes no time at all. Pressing Esc always opens up a save/load (amoungst other things) menu anyway. Everyone (who can download a game) knows this.

Ease of use is an issue, but learning really isn't here.
If it is, then how about showing the hotkey that opens the save/load menu / quicksave key... on the menu itself. That way the first time the player presses Esc and clicks Save, he sees the hotkey required at the top of the save menu. There's no need for him to look down a list of hotkeys before the game.


As for other RPGs, Fallout had no save on the interface. Neither does Arcanum. PS:T did (I think) but it was fairly subtle. I've never missed having a save button.

 

[HanoverF]

quickie experiment...

The floppy offends me cuz who uses floppies in this day and age?

 

[OlSheep]

[text]

Hmmm, correct me if I'm wrong but I detect a bit of frustration here. Don't take anything I say personally, I tend to have problems to gauge my tone when I write in English.

Sure, as I've said, you're right, if the button is useless, it should go. You're just repeating a point we agree on.

My point was: that should be VD's decision. A save button might not look good but it's not entirely useless. As long VD hasn't said anything on that particular topic (or maybe he has and I've missed the post), this problem shouldn't be addressed.

I know the vast majority of games out there do not come with a "save button". But surely there was some kind of design decision behind putting that button right on the UI? That's what I'm trying to "defend".

...that statistics are 90% about proving a point and 10% about relevance?

Come on now, I'm merely trying to be interesting. Believe it or not, I didn't pull these stats out of my ass.

[edit]: As far as the learning thing is concerned, I think my example with Ultima 8 still stands...