I was wrong

[MrSmileyFaceDude]

Speechcraft and Mercantile are still in. Don't confuse fan speculation with fact. As for axes, here's an old screenshot that will give you your answer. They're covered by the Blunt skill.

 

[Zli]

Speechcraft and Mercantile are still in. Don't confuse fan speculation with fact. As for axes, here's an old screenshot that will give you your answer. They're covered by the Blunt skill.

Blunt? Sure, you do the same moves with axes as you do with hammers, but couldn't you find a more suitable name?

 

[Twinfalls]

Nice to know about speech/merc.

Is there any reason why the official list of skills hasn't been put out yet?

 

[MrSmileyFaceDude]

Twinfalls -- *shrugs* I don't know. I think there are more Codex entries planned over the next few months on the main site, and not just team diaries. But aside from that I've been too busy to look into what the information flow is going to be (we've all been extremely busy, which is why there hasn't been a site update in a while in the first place.)

 

[Twinfalls]

fair 'nuff.

I was hoping you'd just tell us what the skills are.

 

[Chefe]

hello world

 

[MINIGUNWIELDER]

Speechcraft and mercantile are still in?

That's a relief... big relief.

As for axes, I never use them, but I know there are many people who do and it's the choices that matter. I think having a more diverse set such as Longblade, Shortblade/Dagger, Axes, Blunt, Staves... is better than just Blade and Blunt.

Why are axes covered by blunt at all? They're most definitley NOT "blunt" weapons. People sharpen axes, they don't sharpen blunt weapons like hammers. You guys do know what "blunt" means, right? Not trying to be mean here, but I'm just wondering.

hafted would be a suitable name... WHY NOT ADD MORE SKILLS INSTEAD OF REMOVE AND COMPRESS SKILLSETS!

i mean damn why not make skill synergies (skills adding bonuses to other skills and possibly adding additional styles) and add more complexities simultaneously!


and do us a favor, tell todd that the only reason the studies on complex games are true because nobody makes complex games
nobody makes them because they believe the studys that show that few people prefer them thus making you guys perpetrating the most vicious of cycles


people have lost hope in fallout because of you

your doing to tes what they did to ultima

 

[TheGreatGodPan]

Does that mean that you'll hit people with the blunt portion of the axe instead of the blade? That would be funny if it resulted from a character's extremely low intelligence, but it just sounds stupid right now.

 

[Micmu]

I think it would be better to "merge" the remaining two melee skills into "Deadly weapan!!!" and end the torment.
That's just sad -- every time you'll play a fighter character, you'll allways be THE Fighter,
no freedom of choice at all. And with medium armor skill gone, no choice in defense, too.
You wouldn't be able to build up specialized fighters with specific weapons and combat styles, like in D&D and other RPG skill systems. Poor.

 

[MINIGUNWIELDER]

I think it would be better to "merge" the remaining two melee skills into "Deadly weapan!!!" and end the torment.
That's just sad -- every time you'll play a fighter character, you'll allways be THE Fighter,
no freedom of choice at all. And with medium armor skill gone, no choice in defense, too.
You wouldn't be able to build up specialized fighters with specific weapons and combat styles, like in D&D and other RPG skill systems. Poor.

THEY COMPRESSED BLADE! :evil:
IF IT DOESENT HAVE MINDLESS HACKNSLAH ON THE COVER, IM SUINIG FOR MISREPRESENTATION!

 

[Naked_Lunch]

your doing to tes what they did to ultima

I wouldn't go that far, at least Oblvion has some resemblance of being an RPG.

/Bought Dragon Edition of Ultima IX

/Uninstalled it two hours later

Dammit, now I'm depressed.

 

[MINIGUNWIELDER]

your doing to tes what they did to ultima

I wouldn't go that far, at least Oblvion has some resemblance of being an RPG.

/Bought Dragon Edition of Ultima IX

/Uninstalled it two hours later

Dammit, now I'm depressed.

ultima VIII notIX

 

[Naked_Lunch]

In comparison, though, Ultima IX is far more worse than Ultima VIII.

 

[Tetragrammaton]

What about spears? There's quite a fuss on the TES forums about them being removed, but it's technically just speculation. I think it would be very sad to see them go, though. They provide for some interesting tactics.

 

[MINIGUNWIELDER]

In comparison, though, Ultima IX is far more worse than Ultima VIII.

i know... i killed someone VEERY important in IX after the shrine of spirituality
THOSE BASTERDS DESTROYED EMPATH ABBEY MY FAVORITE PLACE IN ANY GAME!

 

[Naked_Lunch]

Yeah, Ultima is probably has probably the most convulted continuity I've ever seen. Empath Abbey starts off as a prison, then it becomes just a castle, then it's a church, and then it becomes a church with a jail. All in the span of about 300 years.

It didn't help that EA totally fucked it up the ass, too. I mean, in VIII it took place on an entirely different plane/world (Pagan) and it still screwed things up. (Mordra! How the hell did she get to Skara Brae? The end of VIII has you transported back to Britannia and you see that the Guardian conquered it, but in IX you start off in your house just hanging around like nothing happened. And DON'T even get me started on the Titan of Ether fiasco.)

 

[MINIGUNWIELDER]

Yeah, Ultima is probably has probably the most convulted continuity I've ever seen. Empath Abbey starts off as a prison, then it becomes just a castle, then it's a church, and then it becomes a church with a jail. All in the span of about 300 years.

AN ECO HAPPY CHURCH WITH A JAIL!

It didn't help that EA totally fucked it up the ass, too. I mean, in VIII it took place on an entirely different plane/world (Pagan) and it still screwed things up. (Mordra! How the hell did she get to Skara Brae? The end of VIII has you transported back to Britannia and you see that the Guardian conquered it, but in IX you start off in your house just hanging around like nothing happened. And DON'T even get me started on the Titan of Ether fiasco.)

subjective time...and hawkwind conjured up the moongate that transported you through time and planar boundaries
or the guardian cannot rule britt if your not there not sure

AND TITAN OF ETHER?! wha?

 

[Naked_Lunch]

Obviously you haven't been freshing up on your Ultima.

Hawkind conjured the portal, duh. But, that was in Ultima IX. The ending of Ultima VIII explicity shows the Avatar returning to Britannia, only to find it a ruined wasteland with huge monuments to the Guardian. Yet, in Ultima IX you start right at your house in Texas, nonethewiser. Huh?

To escape from Pagan, the Avatar had to defeat the other Titans, who were the embodiment of the four elements (Fire, Water, Earth, Wind) and become the Titan of Ether - Ether being the source of magic. And being a Titan meant you were all around uber and could basically control magic/ether Neo-style. Yet, once again, in Ultima IX you started out as your typical beginning RPG-hero, with very minor powers. Big WTF there.

 

[Fintilgin]

I still think the best way to do things if they were going to reduce the number of weapons skills would be to have a melee skill and a ranged skill. And then, when you get your perks, allow you to specialize (if you want) in specific weapons.

So, I might have a fighter with 75 melee skill and three sword related perks, and you might have a fighter with three axe related perks. We'd both still be good with other weapons but we'd excell with our chose speciality due to perks.

I mean, if you're going to start combining daggers and claymores in to a single skill, and axes and maces into another, you might as well just bite the bullet and make a single melee skill. It seems like the Morrowind style of one skill per type is one way of doing it, a single skill is another, but the current system blade/'blunt' seems a bit awkward and illogical.

Not that I'm going to lose any sleep over it. You'll still be able to pick a weapon and stick with it it. I very much doubt my longsword weilding character will use any daggers, even really good ones. It just dosn't fit his style, regardless of that fact that he may be skilled with them by default.

Very interesting to hear that both Speechcraft and Mercantile are still in. I was almost postiive that Mercantile would be folded into Speechcraft. It's not just that Mercantile was a fairly useless skill in Morrowind, it's a fairly useless skill in almost every RPG. You're almost always swiming in cash by mid-game. Especially so in an open-ended game like Oblivion, where it's easier to 'go off the rails'. Even if the economy has been seriously tweaked I have a hard time seeing it as a really great skill.

 

[Sol Invictus]

To be fair to Bethesda, most axes and hammers typically weigh the same and the technique required to be proficient in the use of such weapons are not very different.

 

[Section8]

True enough in real life, but melee in MW required the same mouse/keyboard actions across the board, so you could rationalise a merge of all melee skills.

Also, did MW have a unified "melee resistance" or did it have thrust/slash/crush style resistances?

 

[Zli]

To be fair to Bethesda, most axes and hammers typically weigh the same and the technique required to be proficient in the use of such weapons are not very different.

Yes, but naming the category 'Blunt' is a bit, well, retarded. 'Hefted', which someone mentioned, makes much more sense...

 

[Lumpy]

VD: Then, if you keep killing the replacement? Just have a generic, randomized NPC to replace them?

Oh, but you can't have randomized NPCs, since each one is unique. So they would have to make dozens of unique NPCs to replace the killed ones. Now wouldn't that be well spent developing time?

I think that the solution they chose is the best, besides letting the game go on, which would be better. What's wrong with an indicator to show the NPC is essential? I think it's less moronic than a moronic invincibility. Why make them invincible? Maybe I want to see if I'm stronger than the captain of the guards. Why shouldn't I be able to?
And of course, there's always yealding.

 

[franc kaos]

Obviously you haven't been freshing up on your Ultima.
To escape from Pagan, the Avatar had to defeat the other Titans, who were the embodiment of the four elements (Fire, Water, Earth, Wind) and become the Titan of Ether - Ether being the source of magic. And being a Titan meant you were all around uber and could basically control magic/ether Neo-style. Yet, once again, in Ultima IX you started out as your typical beginning RPG-hero, with very minor powers. Big WTF there.

The first RPG I played was U6, didn't finish it, but did play and finish U7 (was it the Isle of Magincia (EDIT: Skara Brae) where a lich had taken over the place and everyone was dead? pure gold storytelling) and then played Ultima Underworld - man, that game blew me away, I remember thinking, this is the future of games, I was in that dungeon, twitching when I got (fell in actually) to the cave of giant spiders, almost killing the first goblin<?> I came to, til I realised they were intelligent and tribal. U8 I didn't like, got used to having a party and loathed U9, but by then EA had raped Richard Garriot (as I recall) - for a good fee, I'm sure. Luckily for me Arena/Daggerfall was there to take its place. Also had FO 1 & 2, Midwinter and Elite: First Encounters (the only <extremely bugged admittedly> space sim to date that let you land on a planet in realtime.
Crap, forgot my point, but it's fun to reminisce.

 

[Claw]

I still think the best way to do things if they were going to reduce the number of weapons skills would be to have a melee skill and a ranged skill. And then, when you get your perks, allow you to specialize (if you want) in specific weapons.

But then they'd have had to call it Gothic 3.