Hell sorta freezes over in Neverwinter

[Otaku_Hanzo]

I like NWN. Not for the OC, not because I think it's the greatest RPG ever, and definitely not because of those wings. Yeesh! :shock:

No, the reason I like NWN is attributed to the HUGE amount of fan created modules out there that give me the chance to play through someone else's story and see how well they implemented the engine. There are plenty of modules out there I will recommend over the OC anyday.

As far as BIO goes, I never really cared for them too much. I would have to say KOTOR is the only achievement of theirs that I can honestly say I loved right from the start. When it comes to RPGs, I'll have to stick with Troika and the old IPLAY/Black Isle. Too bad IPLAY seems to be going nowhere but down now though. It's sad to see what used to be a great company go to waste.

Ah well, TOEE is keeping me happy until the next good RPG comes out. Besides, if worse gets to worse, I always have Daggerfall and the FO's to fall back on.

 

[EEVIAC]

I'd have to agree with Voss - those dragon wings look almost comical. How does he put his armour on with those wings sticking out?

 

[Volourn]

Hazarding a guess, I'd presume it was crafting with the wings in mind. :p Or since this is a crpg; all armour fits all.

 

[Elwro]

Are this screenshots available only to those who pay gamespot? I see only 'x's.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

BG2's Beholders are certainly better than the HoTU ones. http://www.womengamers.com/revprev/adv/bg2ce/beholder.jpg while a small pic, certainly shows the attention to detail the BG2 monster has over this version.

 

[Voss]

Are this screenshots available only to those who pay gamespot? I see only 'x's.

Shouldn't be, since I wouldn't give gamespot a bent penny.
No idea why they won't load for you.

 

[Volourn]

Same here. i didn't pay either, and don't plan to.

 

[AlanC9]

The pics load for me.

I didn't see any superiority in the BG2 screenshot, except in the color palette used in the scene. I don't know what it is about the NWN artists, but they don't seem to be able to use more than a few colors at a time.

Other than that, they're about equal in quality. More eyes on the BG, better animation on the NWN.

As for the wings: I think they're supposed to be jammed on in a Frankenstein kind of way. It's the same character with wings tacked onto the back. Don't ask me why - I have no idea why people wanted Dragon Disciples in the first place.

 

[Psilon]

I don't think people did, but BioWare's already said we're not getting spellcasting prestige classes until they redesign the engine.

 

[Voss]

Hmm. Is that really going to happen?
I wouldn't be surprised to see them move away from licenses, and wizards is likely to insist that a Even More Neverwinter will have to use the 3.5 ruleset. Which will naturally cause a fuss.

On the other paw, its a valuable property, so letting it go would be odd. Though how long is the license agreement with Atari and whoever else is involved in that?

Theres a lot of variables here.

 

[Psilon]

From what I've gathered reading the posts through NWVault, they hardcoded casting ability due to their overly rushed development time. End result: No psionics, no new spell categories, no clones of existing caster classes (e.g., "Performance Artist" in addition to Bard), and certainly no new spellcasting classes.

Beholder abilities, for instance, are actually just spell-like abilities. Blackguards get x-per-day spells rather than true casting. And no Archmage or other "increases spellcasting level but get no other base class abilities" prestige classes appear at all.

Even with Hordes, we're told this isn't changing. It's permanently in the "If/when we make NWN2, then probably" category.

 

[Volourn]

Actually, the main reason for it to be so ahrd coded is when NWN was being made prestige classes did not exist until too late in development to do anything about it.

 

[Sammael]

There is no excuse for hard-coding anything in an engine than took five years to develop. Hard-coding in general is just programmers' laziness (and yes, I am guilty of it myself sometimes), and is used only on tight-schedule projects. Bioware has a thing for hard-coding, though; look at the Infinity Engine - half the bloody ruleset was hard-coded (which made IWD2's 3E transition an even greater undertaking).

 

[Psilon]

Agreed. Even though prestige classes may not have been finalized yet, they should have expected more spellcasters. Psionics, anyone? To hardcode such an essential trait as casting ability is an affront to good software engineering.

Addendum: It turns out that there is in fact a caster prestige class, the Pale Master. However, it would appear to be hardcoded. Why am I not surprised?

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Sorry for this failed Save vs. English, but does hardcoded mean its coded in a way that it cannot later be updated/modified?

 

[Psilon]

Not only that, but it frequently connotes "cannot be modified without causing breakages elsewhere."

Basically, they're doing spellcasting checks against constant class names rather than checking the 2DAs for compatible classes.

 

[Sammael]

Sorry for this failed Save vs. English, but does hardcoded mean its coded in a way that it cannot later be updated/modified?

Sort of. Hard-coded data and rules are compiled into binary files (often the EXE itself, or one of the satellite libraries), and the only way to change them would be to decompile the binary, change the code, and recompile it again. Decompiling the original binaries is difficult and technically illegal, and the changed binary would be overridden by any patch that also makes changes to the original binary (which is most of them).

 

[Voss]

In theory, actually no.
In practice, pretty much.
And its a save vs. jargon. Not English


And psilon...umm. From that post, Georg Zoeller, designer:

I'd suggest not to interprete at all at this point, because, like I said, I don't know what is happening exactly, I can only say that there is something happening with your spellcasting abilities if you are a pale master.

I guess you need to be patient until the pale master profile is out

why does one of the designers not know whats going on?

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Ah, thanks for the explanation :wink:

 

[Psilon]

What's funnier is that Zoeller was hired after showing off his l33t programming skills in NWScript. He should be drooling over the new features. The Neverwinter expansion team isn't that big; either he really needs to stay awake during the staff meetings, or this is the most bald-faced coverup since Fallout Fantasy.

 

[Volourn]

Yeha, like he should know the entire program by heart. *yawn*

 

[Psilon]

According to NWVault, he's a designer. That means he should be aware of the different classes' attributes so that we don't end up with areas practically impassable for certain character classes.

 

[Voss]

Not know it by heart, but he should be aware of the major features being added by the expansion he's working on. And since the PrCs are one of the big things they hype about the expansion, he should at least have a clue.

 

[AlanC9]

Psilon, Zoeller's a "technical designer." That makes him a scripter, not an area designer.

 

[Anonymous]

YOU GUYZ SUCK MY NUTZ