Evil Fallout character?

[Goliath]

Does it make sense to play an evil character in Fallout 1? In every CRPG I have played so far "evil" just means retarded/insane and the only result is that you get less quests. Ok, occasionally you may get an NPC or an item a good boy won't get but being good is still the obvious/only choice if you want to experience most of the game / make successful characters.
Is it different in Fallout? I.e. are their real advantages for evil characters? Can evil characters do stuff good characters cannot?

 

[sheek]

And also (first time playing this) is it worth playing and goody-two-shoes characters? I noticed a lot of karma or whatever traits. Do they make a major difference to the game, more/less interesting plot line?

 

[Seven]

It all depends on how you like to play and what type of feeling you like the game to leave you with. FO will definitely leave you feeling like a dirt bag if you play evil; I don't think quests are closed to you, in a lot of cases it's how you complete the quests or what types of quests you you choose to complete. I don't know whether you've played the game so I don't want to give specific examples. My best advice is to just play the game rather than asking how. If you run into any trouble (bugs) makesure you have a lot of save game backups.

 

[User was nabbed fit]

I could never make myself seriously play in an evil way (as in, I did take the evil options, but just for messing around -- and then I loaded a previous save), unless I forced myself to be pure evil during the whole game.

I'm just a darn-tootin' do-gooder.

 

[Balor]

I'm just a darn-tootin' do-gooder.

That's because:

In every CRPG I have played so far "evil" just means retarded/insane and the only result is that you get less quests.

However, play PS:T or KOTOR2 (though screwed by publisher) for example of evil not being stupid.
I consider Kreia one of 'teh bestest' characters Avellone created.

 

[User was nabbed fit]

That's because:

copx wrote:
In every CRPG I have played so far "evil" just means retarded/insane and the only result is that you get less quests.

notrly.

I'm like that with all games. I can't "naturally" take evil options, because they heavily go against the way I think. It's got something to do with my real life occupation, but let's not get into that on the interwebs.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

That's because:

copx wrote:
In every CRPG I have played so far "evil" just means retarded/insane and the only result is that you get less quests.

notrly.

I'm like that with all games. I can't "naturally" take evil options, because they heavily go against the way I think. It's got something to do with my real life occupation, but let's not get into that on the interwebs.

You're a child pornographer?

 

[User was nabbed fit]

 

[Zomg]

Does it make sense to play an evil character in Fallout 1?

No. The spectrum of characters that make sense goes about from saint to mercenary. Or, maybe bully or vault chauvinist. Plus some non-negotiable benevolence towards Vault 13.

The whole concept of an "evil" character is fucking stupid anyway. Make it possible to play a selfish, or cruel, or bigoted character, but to try to wind them all up into a gestalt beforehand is dumb as rocks.

 

[Astromarine]

You're a child pornographer too?

Fixed.

 

[Falcore19]

I disagree, I think you can play an evil character, especially in Fallout 1.

First, make sure you get rid of the time limit by doing the right quest.

Then, pack your car with all the ammo and guns you find around, buy them too. Don't forget the flame thrower and rocket launcher. Oh and, get yourself a BB gun or a reserve of rocks. You know, for children, cause otherwise they die too quickly.

Lastly, go in every town and kill everyone. Fucking hilarious and fun for a while. Don't dare touching the brahmins though.

Fallout is pretty open ended, but like all games, it's designed with a story in mind, so of course if you kill everyone you won't be able to enjoy all the writing. So I suggest you play a good character first, finish the game and all, then beat the shit out of everyone.

 

[LaDoushe]

Really the best path in the fallout games is to play a complete sociopath. You end up saying whatever you need to say to people to get the best rewards, and then proceed to screw them over if the price is right. This mostly applies if you have the steal trait tagged. You end up doing some small task for the townspeople and then methodically steal every object of value from them. I think that could qualify as evil, more or less.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Fallout games are actually only ones I ever played through with meanie and didn't get screwed like in the cases with infamous bounty hunters in BG or just lesser/worst loot and quest rewards overall.
If you're state of mind tolerates complete dickhead behaviour playing the game, go for it! Fallout is certainly the game where it's actually as rewarding as playing any other character type. And it's also fun because of all the good written nasty dialogue choices.

 

[kingcomrade]

The concept of having an "evil" character suffers from Fantasy Syndrome that comes from a lot of literature. Why are people evil? Because they are! They murder and torture just for fun. Why is Sauron evil? Who knows, but he has built this giant army of orcs to destroy the world because that's what evil people do.
I'm sure everyone has people that they think are evil: George Bush, blacks, smelly Russians, whatever. But do you think those people believe they are evil? A lot of people, no matter how crappy a person they are on an absolute scale, think they are usually in the right.
Take piracy for example. You don't really suffer any real adverse consequences from admitting that it's wrong but you do it anyways, except you do suffer damage to your ego. That's why we get silly arguments like, "Well I wasn't going to pay for it anyways."

In Fallout there's not really any good or evil, just altruism and selfishness and a lot of the scenarios in the game involve both.

 

[WouldBeCreator]

Although I agree with the armchair psychology stuff here that there aren't that many people who act deliberately evil (except, maybe, in high school), I'm not sure that's really relevant to game design. The question isn't whether the (limited) character types games permit you to play track the most common human character types, but rather whether they track the most common character types players would want to play. I don't think games should try to have the avatar mimetically track the player's personality. Instead, the game should let the player express a type he wants to play and run with it.

I suspect that players would rather have the option to play an *evil* character than they would have the option to play a misguided person who tries to do the right thing but has a screwy worldview and winds up doing things that on balance are hurtful, or whatever you think the "real" psychological makeup of "evil" people is. In fact, I think the real problem is that RPGs tend to make "evil" characters functionally identical to good characters, except that they demand more gold.

 

[Blahblah Talks]

The concept of having an "evil" character suffers from Fantasy Syndrome that comes from a lot of literature. Why are people evil? Because they are! They murder and torture just for fun. Why is Sauron evil? Who knows, but he has built this giant army of orcs to destroy the world because that's what evil people do.

I think that's an oversimplification. I never read LOTR, so I can't speak to that example, but as shitty as Wheel of Time was overall, you can at least say that the Forsaken had coherent motivations for their evilness. To say that a lot of fantasy literature has one dimensional evil characters is probably only true if you consider bad fantasy novels 'literature' (in which case, the heros suffer from the same problem).

 

[Moggs]

PS:T is one of the few (if not only) games I've played that had genuinely "motivated" evil characters. I'd like to see more that. Fuck it, I'd like to see more of PS:T, full-stop.

 

[Lumpy]

Evil is understood wrong. That's why it's so hard to play evil characters as people understand them, because they rarely exist. Rather than having good/evil, games should have unselfish/selfish.
Sauron is selfish, because he wants to rule the world, and doesn't care if he makes others suffer. The same can be said about most rule-the-world villains.
There is also sadistical evil though, which is also a form of selfishness, because sadists fulfill their desires while making others suffer. I believe the Dark Brotherhood from Oblivion does this well.

 

[vrok]

Evil characters tell Lou where the vault is and get dipped in FEV. Game over. Fuck the story, I want to take the Master's place and be the Hitler of mutants, converting everyone to the master race.

Seriously, you should be able to continue the game after that as the most super mutant of them all in a series of Slavers-style quests (FO2), invading all the towns and the BoS.

 

[kingcomrade]

That is something I wish you could've done. But alas, there is no faction switching in Fallout. You work for Vault 13 until the very end. You might say that Fallout just encompasses the storyline of the Vault Dweller while he is a member of the Vault. After all, all of the story endings end with you leaving the Vault.

 

[Daigoji_Gai]

Only game, IMHO, that did an evil character well was the first KOTOR. Being a kind veggie tree hugger, forcing myself to be evil was actually painful - especially with some of the comments the characters would make in response...

Otherwise I find that being evil in most RPGs, as was already stated, breaks the narrative of the game because of the massacre syndrome: kill everyone means I am uber evil.

I wish "evil" character gameplay went beyond slaughtering people and going bad. There are just so many other ways to be evil without going down the mass murderer route.

 

[LCJr.]

Otherwise I find that being evil in most RPGs, as was already stated, breaks the narrative of the game because of the massacre syndrome: kill everyone means I am uber evil.

I wish "evil" character gameplay went beyond slaughtering people and going bad. There are just so many other ways to be evil without going down the mass murderer route.

I agree, mass murder is just stupid not evil.

Really the best path in the fallout games is to play a complete sociopath. You end up saying whatever you need to say to people to get the best rewards, and then proceed to screw them over if the price is right. This mostly applies if you have the steal trait tagged. You end up doing some small task for the townspeople and then methodically steal every object of value from them. I think that could qualify as evil, more or less.

I would consider this the "Machevellian" approach. The end justifies the means. *minor spoiler* For example doing all the "evil" jobs for the guy in the Hub then ratting him out to the cops.

 

[Drakron]

KotOR did the best in justify "evil" with Korriban section.

Lets see the NPCs are pretty much evil, you really dont care if they end up well or bad and the whole Sith ideas were a convinient excuse to simply "fuck it" and screw then the worst possible way.

Yes, there were a few that broken the mold but still if you come out of the Leviathan knowing the Jedi pretty much brainwashed you its a easy path to take.

The issue with evil is justification, most games dont offer a evil path because everything is so black and white ... muddle the waters and then make it a path of no return and it funtions ... KotOR did not in that reguard because you still have Bastila offering the choices in a black and white fashion and completly ignore the players actions for the entire game at that point, THAT is BioWare constant error in relation to good/evil because when actions are irrelevant with the exception ofone decision it simply does not matter what you do until that decision.

Aligment exists in the D&D rulebook to enforce roleplay, BioWare adds aligment WITHOUT it enforcing roleplay and so making aligment irrelevent.

 

[bryce777]

First off, sauron is not some guy who woke up and wanted to rule the world. He is a supernatural evil force, trying to open up middle earth to the void so his master can walk free and they can continue their rebellion against the creator, which is furthered whenever they lay their hands upon any of the people or things of middle earth.

As for fallout, an evil character does make sense. Plenty of evil people have fought for their homeland, and basically you are fighting to keep our very home, at the heart.

I restarted fallout 1, and I assassinated hightower because the money was good, but that does not mean I wold take delight in shooting a bunch of people for no reason. So, I am playing a more or less selfish character, I suppose. IE evil.

Yeah, ou might not have a waxed mustache and cape or act like jefre dahmr, but that is borin anhow.

 

[Spazmo]

I don't recall Fallout ever using the word "evil" anyways. If you were a dick, you'd get negative karma. Some people would like you better, some people would like you less. And Fallout also never would have situations like:

NPC little girl: Please, save my kitten!
PC: 1- Of course!
2- Of course, if you pay me!
3- BWA HA HA HA HA! I will savagely rape you, eat your kitten, and burn down your house because I am a very complex and morally conflicted person and use the "twisted" smiley a lot on webforums!
4- Rumours?

In Fallout, if you did "evil" stuff, there was a valid reason for it. Usually money, but then there was often money to encourage good guy actions too.