Blizzard announced "Classic" World of Warcraft

[volklore]

I think the hardcore servers were corrupted from the start because there were no restrictions on grouping outside of dungeons, so everyone leveled in a duo, invalidating the whole idea. What they should've done is restrict grouping to dungeon stones exclusively before level 60, so you'd have to touch the dungeon stone in order to be put in a group and you are automatically kicked if you are not in a dungeon in 5 minutes or something. I'm glad I didn't give in to the hype. It IS a good idea and probably the most interesting thing WoW has had going for it since original TBC, but it requires much more work than Blizzard put in.

I do agree with this somewhat. Although I still think there is fun to be had there, only reason to speed level in groups was to race world first raid kills which most people won't do.
In a lot of ways HC is a lot more chill than classic or even pservers were due to the fact that raiding is a lot less likely as an endgame goal. I think horde on stitches EU just killed ony last reset for example. Late game 5mans are already plenty fun with one life.
But yeah it's sadly the fucking story with blizz. Just take ideas that pservers/community did for years and put the least amount of effort possible into it, and for the most part do it worse. I played a bit on K3 private server before the release of classic and that server had actually finished the LoS mechanics by adding it to trees and a bunch of other models that do not have it game (Like some of the troll ruins).

 

[Talby]

 

[Gromoer]

I think the hardcore servers were corrupted from the start because there were no restrictions on grouping outside of dungeons, so everyone leveled in a duo, invalidating the whole idea. What they should've done is restrict grouping to dungeon stones exclusively before level 60, so you'd have to touch the dungeon stone in order to be put in a group and you are automatically kicked if you are not in a dungeon in 5 minutes or something. I'm glad I didn't give in to the hype. It IS a good idea and probably the most interesting thing WoW has had going for it since original TBC, but it requires much more work than Blizzard put in.

But that’s like.. taking away all the fun from wow.

 

[Late Bloomer]

But that’s like.. taking away all the fun from wow.

I understand your sentiment, but doing a solo run on the unofficial hardcore server, with the mod, was a lot of fun. The community built around it was very robust and interactive. There was a certain amount of enjoyment with how it all played out with death announcements, final words being posted in chat, seeing a lot of other people out in the world making their way through the challenge, that made the world feel alive. Guild chat was linked with other guilds, and was very active. I had friends from as far back as EQ playing too, so it was fun to keep track of and talk about our trial and tribulations. There was no AH, mail, can't ask for buffs, and only one dungeon run per character (you could only do deadmines once as an example). The mod (rules) allowed for duo and trio but with a caveat. You couldn't be in seperate zones (had to remain a certain distance from one another) and you could only be logged in at the same time. Otherwise, the run would be invalid.. I leveled up duo and it was fun too, but the solo challenge was the most fun.

There are a lot of people (autist mostly) that enjoy these type of strict rules. Blizzard would be foolish to not introduce a special rules server, once the success of the current offical hardcore server dies down. Right now, there are way to many people playing (mostly alliance) on the main official hc server to introduce anything that would potentialy interupt that.

 

[Lacrymas]

Duo leveling is just too easy. The challenge is already not the hardest ever, especially if you are playing a priest, paladin, mage, warlock, druid, hunter, so making it even easier goes against the spirit imo.

 

[Gromoer]

But that’s like.. taking away all the fun from wow.

I understand your sentiment, but doing a solo run on the unofficial hardcore server, with the mod, was a lot of fun. The community built around it was very robust and interactive. There was a certain amount of enjoyment with how it all played out with death announcements, final words being posted in chat, seeing a lot of other people out in the world making their way through the challenge, that made the world feel alive. Guild chat was linked with other guilds, and was very active. I had friends from as far back as EQ playing too, so it was fun to keep track of and talk about our trial and tribulations. There was no AH, mail, can't ask for buffs, and only one dungeon run per character (you could only do deadmines once as an example). The mod (rules) allowed for duo and trio but with a caveat. You couldn't be in seperate zones (had to remain a certain distance from one another) and you could only be logged in at the same time. Otherwise, the run would be invalid.. I leveled up duo and it was fun too, but the solo challenge was the most fun.

There are a lot of people (autist mostly) that enjoy these type of strict rules. Blizzard would be foolish to not introduce a special rules server, once the success of the current offical hardcore server dies down. Right now, there are way to many people playing (mostly alliance) on the main official hc server to introduce anything that would potentialy interupt that.

Yeah, well those rules you mentioned make sense. I am in fact that kind of an autist.
As far as I understand the restriction about groups in this case was about making it impossible to get free XP while being in a different location? If so, it makes sense, though I thought this is basic mechanic in WoW.

 

[Late Bloomer]

Yeah, well those rules you mentioned make sense. I am in fact that kind of an autist.
As far as I understand the restriction about groups in this case was about making it impossible to get free XP while being in a different location? If so, it makes sense, though I thought this is basic mechanic in WoW.

If I am understanding your question correctly, the restriction was to force the players who formed a duo or trio to always have to play together. As for grouping at random, it was to prevent players from forming groups for the tougher aspects of the game world. Things like caves, elite mobs, and certain escort quests. I never thought about the XP while being in different locations, but yes, that being restricted would certainly be a reason not to allow it.

As it stands now, grouping for these aspects of the game, does happen regularly. Dungeons can be completed once per day. I was able to get an item I wanted from Zul'farrak on my third attempt, which would have been restriced on the unoffical servers. It certainly is a lot easier to get to 60. It is still quite fun though and a decent challenge is still there. As an example, I made a careless pull solo, one to many basilisk with their 4 second stun was pretty never wracking while also being at a spot where a 60 elite pathed.

Here are the rules for duo and trio from the (addon) before the official hardcore servers came out.

Addon
All member of a duo or trio are required to have the addon, meet at level 1, and select your team in the addon before beginning your adventure

Class combination
You must choose a combo that spawns in the same starting location OR find a way to meet in the middle before any of you dings level 2.

Stick together
You must stay in the same zone together eg Darkshore (unless you are a Druid going to Moonglade to complete essential class quests).

Presence
You must be logged on together at the same time even if not questing.

Cling together, swing together
You are Soulbound and share one life. If one of you dies, the other/s must fall on the sword and the run is over.

Trading
You can trade any solo self found items or crafted items only to each other including conjurables and gold.

 

[Gromoer]

Yeah, well those rules you mentioned make sense. I am in fact that kind of an autist.
As far as I understand the restriction about groups in this case was about making it impossible to get free XP while being in a different location? If so, it makes sense, though I thought this is basic mechanic in WoW.

If I am understanding your question correctly, the restriction was to force the players who formed a duo or trio to always have to play together. As for grouping at random, it was to prevent players from forming groups for the tougher aspects of the game world. Things like caves, elite mobs, and certain escort quests. I never thought about the XP while being in different locations, but yes, that being restricted would certainly be a reason not to allow it.

As it stands now, grouping for these aspects of the game, does happen regularly. Dungeons can be completed once per day. I was able to get an item I wanted from Zul'farrak on my third attempt, which would have been restriced on the unoffical servers. It certainly is a lot easier to get to 60. It is still quite fun though and a decent challenge is still there. As an example, I made a careless pull solo, one to many basilisk with their 4 second stun was pretty never wracking while also being at a spot where a 60 elite pathed.

Here are the rules for duo and trio from the (addon) before the official hardcore servers came out.

Addon
All member of a duo or trio are required to have the addon, meet at level 1, and select your team in the addon before beginning your adventure

Class combination
You must choose a combo that spawns in the same starting location OR find a way to meet in the middle before any of you dings level 2.

Stick together
You must stay in the same zone together eg Darkshore (unless you are a Druid going to Moonglade to complete essential class quests).

Presence
You must be logged on together at the same time even if not questing.

Cling together, swing together
You are Soulbound and share one life. If one of you dies, the other/s must fall on the sword and the run is over.

Trading
You can trade any solo self found items or crafted items only to each other including conjurables and gold.

Oh, I think I’m starting getting it, thanks for explaining this. Now it makes more sense to me. So in order to play with somebody in a group you had to chose your companions from the start (along with other restrictions)? And other than that, you couldn’t form any other groups except for dungeons?

That’s pretty hardcore and I like it, is this still a thing?

 

[Late Bloomer]

Oh, I think I’m starting getting it, thanks for explaining this. Now it makes more sense to me. So in order to play with somebody in a group you had to chose your companions from the start (along with other restrictions)? And other than that, you couldn’t form any other groups except for dungeons?

That’s pretty hardcore and I like it, is this still a thing?

Yes, that's exactly it when it came to duo/trio.

Sadly, with the official hardcore servers (there are multiple, but one in US and one EU have all the players) in full motion, everyone is playing by Blizzards more lax ruleset. There is AH, trading, mail service, group whenever you want. You can do one same dungeon a day (so only one deadmines run per day as an example), bubble hearth is not a thing, no leashing mobs across zones in regards to griefing, it's perfectly fine to ask for buffs. I don't think I left much out. I think when the popularity of this starts to subside (it is showing zero signs of that, if anything its getting busier) that a harsher ruleset server would be ideal. I just don't have confidence in nuBlizzard to understand their playerbase.

 

[Talby]

Those weird autistic restrictions made up by the mod author ruin the point of playing an MMO, it's much better if it's just "dead is dead" with no further changes. Even the dungeon lockout seemed unnecessary.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Those weird autistic restrictions made up by the mod author ruin the point of playing an MMO, it's much better if it's just "dead is dead" with no further changes. Even the dungeon lockout seemed unnecessary.

Eh, I think it's more about limiting steamrolling. I knew some guys who ran around as a group of 5 orc hunters, all on vent. They basically one shot anything they could see. Probably looked almost like a multiboxer.

 

[Lacrymas]

The restrictions were there to make the challenge actually challenging. Otherwise, there's nothing stopping you from spamming dungeons and having a 0% chance to die.

 

[Talby]

It's a cooperative game so I don't see the issue there. Teaming up is the point. People die constantly in hardcore, both in the open world an in dungeons.

 

[Lacrymas]

We've had enough time to play it as a cooperative game, the hardcore challenge was something else.

 

[Gromoer]

As I see it there’s nothing that stops players from cooperating in open world. It’s just that grouping that isn’t allowed. Which I find interesting.

 

[Wilian]

But that’s like.. taking away all the fun from wow.

I understand your sentiment, but doing a solo run on the unofficial hardcore server, with the mod, was a lot of fun. The community built around it was very robust and interactive. There was a certain amount of enjoyment with how it all played out with death announcements, final words being posted in chat, seeing a lot of other people out in the world making their way through the challenge, that made the world feel alive. Guild chat was linked with other guilds, and was very active. I had friends from as far back as EQ playing too, so it was fun to keep track of and talk about our trial and tribulations. There was no AH, mail, can't ask for buffs, and only one dungeon run per character (you could only do deadmines once as an example). The mod (rules) allowed for duo and trio but with a caveat. You couldn't be in seperate zones (had to remain a certain distance from one another) and you could only be logged in at the same time. Otherwise, the run would be invalid.. I leveled up duo and it was fun too, but the solo challenge was the most fun.

There are a lot of people (autist mostly) that enjoy these type of strict rules. Blizzard would be foolish to not introduce a special rules server, once the success of the current offical hardcore server dies down. Right now, there are way to many people playing (mostly alliance) on the main official hc server to introduce anything that would potentialy interupt that.

Those unofficial hardcore rules also had choice for duos and grouping.

 

[Gromoer]

Died three times already lol. Beaten to death by kobalds, eaten by wolves, died because of some connection issues. Great experience overall. I wonder what would be the workaround for spotty connection issues though (except for finding another ISP), as that was really frustrating and most likely on the side of the game server.

Can anybody explain me the thing with this addon please. AFAIU it could be used both on the official and private servers. What would be the difference between the two gameplay-wise? I made some reading and as I understand the addon doesn’t actually prevent from resurrecting a char, but merely reports if someone died or did something that contradicts the rules. In this case there should be somebody who cares in the first place… so who are they?

 

[Steve]

It's a cooperative game so I don't see the issue there. Teaming up is the point. People die constantly in hardcore, both in the open world an in dungeons.

Exactly. Also grouping with randoms is a huge risk. You can never know if they're griefers, shit players or just plain ol'retards. The wipe compilations on youtube are a window to human psychology showing how most people act when shit hits the fan. You could also just play solo and just grind green mobs until you hit 60 and claim your 1337 gamer status but then again, nobody gives a fuck.

HC WoW is currently my go to "chill" game, I just go do few quests, progress a little and have a good time interacting with other people, I like how there is no urge to rush to 60 just so you can afk in towns to wait for raid lockouts.

 

[volklore]

Almost died to a few things.
-Got distracted by a ongoing ony wipe spam from the deathlog addon and pulled too many mobs
-Got into a quest that had an elite mob and a bunch of adds (elite spawned on me after I killed a bunch of mobs during the event) which wasn't marked as a elite quest. Got out after nuking the elite and target dummy + speed potion out but it was close.
-Verdant in the Wailing Cavern hits like a truck. Had to potion + healthstone because my healer wasn't ready for it and was wanding the boss.

I love how dungeons are so fucking scary for the first few pulls as a tank until you figure out if you can trust your group or not. I had a great group for BFD and it was just usual classic wow zooming, but my WC group was a lot sketchier. Also the priest in that group left thinking we were done before the escort quest, which we decided to try without a healer. Had to use a lot of potions/healthtone/ Dummy + bandage combos but it worked out although I wouldnt recommend.

 

[ind33d]

I always played MMOs on RP/PVP servers, and the experience was much better. WOW will always degenerate into Diablo-style Baal Runs unless players treat it as a fantasy-themed chat room like the developers originally intended. The difference between Classic and Retail is that the playerbase metagames too much now, not that Retail itself is necessarily that much worse. Hardcore fixes some of these problems, but then you get other issues like collusion and players wiping on purpose. Doing autistic stuff like giving other players in cities buffs in exchange for money or buying high and selling low on the auction house should get as much devtime as dungeons. Why the entire endgame revolves around raids makes no sense

 

[whydoibother]

No way I'm playing a game designed and balanced around dying (some class/race abilities literally require you to die) in hardcore mode.
However, I know the game well enough to enjoy the hardcore death compilations. Please continue leveling for 100 hours and then falling down the elevator, its great.

 

[Sarathiour]

The old joke indeed was that NE is the minmaxer choice when you're a garbage player.

 

[Zeriel]

I always played MMOs on RP/PVP servers, and the experience was much better. WOW will always degenerate into Diablo-style Baal Runs unless players treat it as a fantasy-themed chat room like the developers originally intended. The difference between Classic and Retail is that the playerbase metagames too much now, not that Retail itself is necessarily that much worse. Hardcore fixes some of these problems, but then you get other issues like collusion and players wiping on purpose. Doing autistic stuff like giving other players in cities buffs in exchange for money or buying high and selling low on the auction house should get as much devtime as dungeons. Why the entire endgame revolves around raids makes no sense

It kinda didn't in vanilla. Thing is Classic is not vanilla. As I've said before, it defeats the whole purpose and selling point of the product. Like selling you tickets to a Rolling Stone concert and then it's some cover band.

 

[Gromoer]

I always played MMOs on RP/PVP servers, and the experience was much better. WOW will always degenerate into Diablo-style Baal Runs unless players treat it as a fantasy-themed chat room like the developers originally intended. The difference between Classic and Retail is that the playerbase metagames too much now, not that Retail itself is necessarily that much worse. Hardcore fixes some of these problems, but then you get other issues like collusion and players wiping on purpose. Doing autistic stuff like giving other players in cities buffs in exchange for money or buying high and selling low on the auction house should get as much devtime as dungeons. Why the entire endgame revolves around raids makes no sense

It kinda didn't in vanilla. Thing is Classic is not vanilla. As I've said before, it defeats the whole purpose and selling point of the product. Like selling you tickets to a Rolling Stone concert and then it's some cover band.

What are the main differences?

 

[Great Deceiver]

Classic wow was filled with single moms who sexted guild leaders to be invited into MC to afk for 2/3rds of the run while the raid listened to their children cry over the mic incessantly for 4 hours