Pete Hines Audio Interview

HardCode · Oct 15, 2005

The following quotes were clipped from a user at the "other forum", whom took the time to transcribe a few important (or not) items from the audio interview of Pete Hines. The quotes within the quote block are supposed to be Pete, but I haven't listened to the interview, so take it for what it is worth, if anything. Regardless, I'll offer my comments for those who care:

He covers how the game isn't being dumbed down.

The evidence against this is to follow ...

He talks about how the quest journal is now arranged by individual quests.

Finally!

He gives an example of the quest location markers on the world map - in the example given, you have to talk to any beggar you can find, so the map marks every beggar you can possibly talk to - it says that usually however, only one quest location/NPC will be marked at a time (I'm sure that's very small comfort to people upset about this)

Not being dumbed down?

He talks about the crime system. It uses the same fine or go to jail system from Morrowind. He says getting thrown in jail for committing a non-violent crime will result in geting approached by someone in the thieves guild who will invite you to join. Likewise, the Dark Brotherhood will invite you if you kill an innocent person.

Okay, finally a little sun-ray of depth coming through, although this is probably the extent of it. If not, perhaps there will be good things in the game.

He says there are stats like how many items we've stolen, how many people we've killed, etc.

BFD (as in, Big Fucking Deal).

He says we can get to the end of all four guilds. (He says "all four").

Interesting ... a new guild? Or did he imply a faction and mis-speak?

He talks about enemy AI. Pretty much the same thing we've already heard. He says enemies may run away, go buy a weapon, come back, and continue the fight - lol!

This sounds great. I hope it is as stated in the real game.

He says there are "hundreds of different sliders" we can use to customize our face, and that we can finalize or edit any class, race, etc. choices we've made.

Now I am worried. Has he even looked at the product? There are hardly of "hundreds of different sliders", rather more like hundreds of combinations to make using the actual number of sliders. Makes you wonder if anything he says is accurate at this point.

He's asked if the NPC AI with respect to crime is like Fable, and he says "oh yeah, it's just like it was in Morrowind." (huh?) He does say your actions (good or evil) will effect who will and won't speak to you to a certain extent. (Good or bad people).

Talking out of his ass? Can we believe the second part?

He says in Oblivion you can play as a mage, thief, or warrior (or anything in between) without having to cross between classes and still do just as well as you would if you did.

Perhaps a promise of class balance.

He talks a bit about the level tier perks. He says you can briefly paralyze (automatically) enemies with a "neck strike" if you advance blade skill far enough.

Shouldn't that be an instant kill? Nothing wrong with implementing special skill perks, but if you are a master of alchemy, should that allow you to paint fences with a spoon?

"You can kill anybody," he says.

Sure, then the stupid friggin' forced reload window pops up if you kill an "important" NPC. Oh, wait, you'd have to be a moron to actually kill an important NPC, because there will be a nice big floating "Important NPC" arrow floating above their head. (If you read that literally, it's not my problem).

He said we can expect "about average for your average first person shooter," when asked about the number of characters on screen at a time in battles "six to eight." He said there are some larger battles, though.

NICE! The first offical statement showing Oblivion compared to FPS games! At least they are now getting a little more honest. Freudian slip?

He said developing for the Xbox 360 was "about as easy as you could expect it to be." "We love working with Microsoft." "It's been fun for us...they've helped us out a lot." "We're just scratching the surface in the launch window" (there's another self-contradictory release date statement!)

"Yeah we're planning to be a launch title" (there's another one!)
"We're planning to be a day one launch title." LOL and another! But don't talk about it - they'll lock your thread because it's your fault he said that!

These quotes need no explaination. If you need one, turn off your PC now and hide in the closet

He says their goal is 30 frames per second "everywhere." "It's a little challenging because we have so many different environments." "It's a challenge for us to get it absolutely everywhere."

Nice, the "uber-1337 n3xT G3nerashun graphixz0rz" game coming in at a pathetic 30 FPS. I got more than that in Counter-Strike with a TI4400, about 4 years ago.

He says "we already have plans to do downloadable content on a regular basis, once a month, couple times a month...." "One is horse armor." "You can buy this downloadable stuff that will let you go to different places that will let you buy your own horse." "The other thing is something we did in Daggerfall, which is holidays." "On Jester day you can go to town and all the crimes in the town are 50% off...so just different stuff like that."

He says he doesn't know about player created mods on Xbox, because Microsoft might not allow it. He says they'd like to be able to do it.

Of-fucking-course Microsoft won't let user made mods be downloadable when they will be charging for stuff that should have been in the game anyway.

Saint_Proverbius · Oct 15, 2005

Thanks for the link!

Chefe · Oct 15, 2005

He says there are stats like how many items we've stolen, how many people we've killed, etc.

This was one of the dumber points in Fable. Nice to see it made its way into Oblivion. :roll:

ES Fan 1: "HAY! How meny doodz u kill?"
ES Fan 2: "I keel 50!"
ES Fan 1: "N00b! I pwn ur stoopid skore n i huv 82!"

To those who haven't played Fable, it's a big page with stupid stats like "People killed", "Enemies Killed", "Secrets Found", "Items Stolen", "Chickens Kicked", "Longest Chicken Kick", "Girls Fucked", "People Who Love You", etc. It completely takes you out of the immersion, even moreso than the "There's a quest card at the guild for you" voiceover.

Pete sucks. Most of the time it sounds like he knows even less about the game than the kids at the ES boards. I could program a bot that would spit out more ass-talking answers than him.

Micmu · Oct 15, 2005

He gives an example of the quest location markers on the world map - in the example given, you have to talk to any beggar you can find, so the map marks every beggar you can possibly talk to - it says that usually however, only one quest location/NPC will be marked at a time (I'm sure that's very small comfort to people upset about this)

Following the red dots and killing things in between, eh?
An auto-play checkbox would be nice then, too.

Psilon · Oct 15, 2005

I thought the four guilds were the fighters, mages, thieves, and assassins.

Stupid stats: Fate also tracked number of barrels destroyed, footsteps taken, and the like. It's fun for a roguelike, but potentially deadly for a game that claims to offer non-combat options.

"Finalize" class and race choices? The OK button is interview-quality material but we still can't hear anything about the magic system?

One step forward, two steps back...

Drakron · Oct 15, 2005

Well one thing, the human eye cannot see the diference above 30 FPS, there is no point of having something running at 30 FPS or 60 FPS because you cannot notice the diference.

The reason people want high FPS is either because bigger=better (desipte the fact it makes no diference) or because there is usually a drop of frame rate aÃ±d so having a very high frame rate means its unlikely it ever goes under 30 FPS.

So its a noble goal to have a consistent frame rate of the human eye limit during the entire game.

Psilon · Oct 15, 2005

Wrong. In immersive VR, the difference between 30 FPS and 60 FPS is significant.

Section8 · Oct 15, 2005

Whee, here we go taking third hand info at face value.

He talks about the crime system. It uses the same fine or go to jail system from Morrowind. He says getting thrown in jail for committing a non-violent crime will result in geting approached by someone in the thieves guild who will invite you to join. Likewise, the Dark Brotherhood will invite you if you kill an innocent person.

Er, shouldn't that work the other way around? If you commit theft successfully, ie without winding your fool self up in fucking jail, or kill without facing the punishment, then you'd think that's an indicator of you having the right stuff. You'd think that a pair of secretive "OMFG stelth!" organisations would have their own clandestine eyes watching out for new recruits, without courting clumsy felons.

He says there are stats like how many items we've stolen, how many people we've killed, etc.

Yeah, cute, but I'd rather see meaning reputations built on the back of these stats.

He does say your actions (good or evil) will effect who will and won't speak to you to a certain extent. (Good or bad people).

Would be nice, but my money's on being able to bribe your way into anyone's good books.

He says in Oblivion you can play as a mage, thief, or warrior (or anything in between) without having to cross between classes and still do just as well as you would if you did.

This worries me. I hope this means "We're including interesting options based on character archetypes" and not "There's no challenge to anything, so any old character can do it."

He talks a bit about the level tier perks. He says you can briefly paralyze (automatically) enemies with a "neck strike" if you advance blade skill far enough.

The system has promise, but that's a piss poor example. If you're skillful enough to be able to aim for an opponents neck and hit with a sharp pointy thing, then severing the vital nervous and vascular bits would be more logical. Plus, neck injuries tend to result in slightly more permanent paralysis.

Also, the (automatically) is a bit weak. It sounds like an extended critical hit system more than player controlled depth, which Morrowind's combat was desperately crying out for. But, unless you're leaning toward FPS elements, it's difficult to appropriately interface to make called shots in a FP RT game.

Of-fucking-course Microsoft won't let user made mods be downloadable when they will be charging for stuff that should have been in the game anyway.

Yeah, that's pretty fucking low. I hope it doesn't go one step further, with Bethesda/Microsoft foxing mods for the PC if they implement purchasable features.

jiujitsu · Oct 15, 2005

Those quotes make me sad.

HardCode · Oct 15, 2005

Saint_Proverbius said:
Thanks for the link!

:shock: http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/inde ... 73993&st=0

Oddly, www.msxbox-world.com, as the link is posted in that thread, seems to be off the Internet at this time.

EDIT: The original thread: http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/inde ... pic=173006

Mech · Oct 15, 2005

jiujitsu said:
Those quotes make me sad.

The quotes also came from a local fucktard who made about 20 release date threads before getting the hint. I would actually listen to it first before taking what he has to say at face vaule.

DarkUnderlord · Oct 15, 2005

when asked about the number of characters on screen at a time in battles "six to eight."

Now that's just pathetically sad. High-end graphics might be nice but if they're coming at the expense of content, you've got a problem. A big problem. Hell, I prefer Doom 2 over Doom 3 simply because the former doesn't chug poorly, has good lighting and can have hundreds of monsters in a room at the one time for maxiumum killing action, versus the latter which can only handle about 9.

HardCode said:
He says their goal is 30 frames per second "everywhere." "It's a little challenging because we have so many different environments." "It's a challenge for us to get it absolutely everywhere."

Click to expand...

Nice, the "uber-1337 n3xT G3nerashun graphixz0rz" game coming in at a pathetic 30 FPS. I got more than that in Counter-Strike with a TI4400, about 4 years ago.

Considering 24 frames per second is all you need to show movement to the human eye (ever heard anyone complain about the poor frame-rate of a movie of late?) I don't think that'll be a problem.

He gives an example of the quest location markers on the world map - in the example given, you have to talk to any beggar you can find, so the map marks every beggar you can possibly talk to

That's just sad. What happens if you don't do the quest right at that time? Do all the buggers stay highlighted on your compass until you talk to them all? By the way, who's willing to bet every single one of those bastards is an "Important NPC" too?

He talks about enemy AI. Pretty much the same thing we've already heard. He says enemies may run away, go buy a weapon, come back, and continue the fight - lol!

Great. You're fighting someone in the middle of the forest, they run away, only to turn around and chase you for the entirety of the game before you finally kill them. Game developers really need to understand that when people run away, they RUN. THE FUCK. AWAY. They don't come back. They don't run for 5 seconds and then turn around again ala Arcanum and Diablo), they run away and they DO NOT RETURN. They sure as hell don't try to find a bigger weapon just to come back and die at your hand. Christ Almighty.

"You can kill anybody," he says.

HAHAHAHA. Now we know Pete really is "full of shit" Hines.

Elwro · Oct 15, 2005

I'm sure you can kill anyone in Oblivion. It's just that the game will reload after killing some folks, which is great because you'll get to kill them again!!. Or you could use the legendary TES freedom and choose not to do it.

MrSmileyFaceDude · Oct 15, 2005

Actually the auto reload thing is gone. NPCs marked as essential (a status which can and does change) now go "unconscious" for a period of time, then get back up again. Like many things in the game, it's something we've gone through several iterations of implementation, play testing & feedback, and re-implementation. We've changed lots & lots of things about the game -- some just tweaks, some complete overhauls -- based on playtesting feeback, to make sure the game is as balanced and fun as possible.

The paralysis skill perk isn't really specifically a "neck strike". If you reach Master (100) in a combat skill, you can do a particular power attack that has a CHANCE of temporarily paralyzing your opponent. Yes, it's a die roll. There are a lot of those in the game, believe it or not.

Yeah, there are a lot of stats that are kept track of. Some of them, but not all of them, go into disposition. Two that do are your current bounty, of course, just like in Morrowind, and a new one called Infamy. Infamy goes up every time you commit a crime, but never goes back down again. It's used in conjunction with an NPC's Responsibility (among many other factors) to calculate disposition. A responsible shopkeeper may not be as willing to haggle with someone of high infamy. I believe I have already talked about this.

Six to eight -- we do have battle sequences with more characters than that. Most encounters you have will be with fewer, some will have more. If you actually read the entirety quoted passage there, you'll see Pete mention the word "average" twice.

I have already explained that an NPC who already HAS a weapon will not attempt to acquire a BETTER weapon. They'll only go get one if they are unarmed and there's a weapon nearby with which they'd do better than hand to hand or magic. You guys assume that when one anecdote is mentioned about RAI, that EVERYTHING is that way. Don't, because that's simply not the case. The only thing that EVERYTHING depends on is the particular situation at hand -- the NPC's equipment, skills & stats, what if anything is nearby, etc. If an NPC or creature decides to flee, that's just what they'll do. It all depends on the situation & stats.

Balor · Oct 15, 2005

Considering 24 frames per second is all you need to show movement to the human eye (ever heard anyone complain about the poor frame-rate of a movie of late?)

I'm sorry, DU, but this marks you as ignorant in that field.
You CAN see the difference between 20 and 40, heck, even 40 and 60 FPS, especially when it comes to 'hawt action'.
Only from 100+ FPS most eyes fail to see the difference.
Why? The answer is very simple, form the obvious "30 FPS is average FPS, means there would be less then 30 sometimes, and that would be noticeable", to the fact, that, unlike frames in movies, frames in computer games are discrete.

It just dumb to compare movies and games - what, you didn't ever try to pause your vid when an actor was performing a rapid movement?
If you did, what did you see?
BLUR. Yea, right, motion blur.
It serves as transition and fools the eyes.
When it comes to games, like I said, each frame is discrete, with no blur to cover low granularity of transition.
I hope now it's clear that 30 (or 24) FPS is definitely not best possible framerate.
Above 100 - now, that's an other thing.

Vault Dweller · Oct 15, 2005

MrSmileyFaceDude said:
Actually the auto reload thing is gone. NPCs marked as essential (a status which can and does change) now go "unconscious" for a period of time, then get back up again.

That's amazing. Where do you guys come up with ideas like that?

Yeah, there are a lot of stats that are kept track of. Some of them, but not all of them, go into disposition. Two that do are your current bounty, of course, just like in Morrowind, and a new one called Infamy. Infamy goes up every time you commit a crime, but never goes back down again. It's used in conjunction with an NPC's Responsibility (among many other factors) to calculate disposition. A responsible shopkeeper may not be as willing to haggle with someone of high infamy. I believe I have already talked about this.

Haven't heard that one. The idea is good, but are there any other than "I won't give you a discount" consequences? How about "we don't deal with the likes of you" ranging from stores refusing to sell/buy (especially buy, I guess) from you to people who won't give you quests if your Infamy is high enough?

Elwro · Oct 15, 2005

MrSmileyFaceDude said:
Actually the auto reload thing is gone. NPCs marked as essential (a status which can and does change) now go "unconscious" for a period of time, then get back up again.

It's definitely better than auto-reloading - at least now you can loot 'em :D (I hope).
I wonder how it's explained in-game, though. Does the PC know that he has not killed the enemy? Or does he think that he has, only to be surprised in the future that an Unknown Mysterious Force revived his foe?

Balor · Oct 15, 2005

Hmm, can you browbeat NPCs into cooperation if your Infamy rating is high?
I mean, does it serve only as negative modifier, or you may actually play an 'evil murdere' type character, and the game will support this?

MrSmileyFaceDude · Oct 15, 2005

It just shows a message "{essential NPC name} is unconscious", whether you do it or someone/something else does.

Drakron · Oct 15, 2005

Balor said:
I'm sorry, DU, but this marks you as ignorant in that field.
You CAN see the difference between 20 and 40, heck, even 40 and 60 FPS, especially when it comes to 'hawt action'.

Yes, I was incorrect.

http://www.daniele.ch/school/30vs60/30vs60_3.html

Of course you have a real hard time getting something to consistent run at 72 FPS, the 30 FPS is not much "FPS" but more of Nvidia making their tech demos run at 30 FPS, we assume 30 FPS being the limit because for many years getting that was the goal and continues to be the goal.

HardCode · Oct 15, 2005

Well, thanks to Steve for clearing up the mess the PR department is making.

I don't adore the "unconcious" idea ... but I think it is a better alternative than a forced reload. However, I think that if someone plays a character that kills everyone, including important NPCs, they should suffer the consequences. In reality, you could kill anyone you wanted in MW for an alternative, albiet "accidental", method of completing the Main Quest - a la "beat MW in 8 minutes" video.

Just curious, why not have someone in PR update the public on these openly debated/chastized game topics as development progresses? Talking and debating games pre-release, on the Internet, is pretty much the standard today. Are there any market research studies that show the number of people whom discuss games on Internet forums are too insignificant to justify a PR employee who updates the public, answers questions, etc? At least, like in this case, the openly hated "Forced Reload". You have informed us it has changed. While I appreciate that you clarified this in my thread here, wouldn't it be worthwhile for a PR person to openly update the public on that change?

See, you are still refining and changing, like you said. Consumer feedback would still be important, even at this stage of development. Why not take advantage of it? It also would make the public say, "Wow. Bethesda are great. They keep us updated on things as they progress." Currently, except for the fan-tards, most people say, "Why the hell won't Bethesda offer any information about the game?"

I am not talking screenshots and storyline and quests. I'm talking about the game mechanics, like "Forced Reload", and skills, and such, that make or break the game regardless of graphics and storyline and quests.

Gwendo · Oct 15, 2005

Console Gold's interview with Kathode:

CG: How does the bartering system work? How about fenced goods? In Morrowind it seemed that the shopkeepers could spot stolen goods from a mile away, will that be toned down to make pilfering more viable?

Shopkeepers will still not accept stolen goods. Luckily for compulsive stealers, the Thieves Guild has fences who have no such scruples.

Damn! How do they know it's stolen?
BTW, will shpkeepers have limited budget too? (You find a nice piece of armor, but you can't find a buyer because it's too expensive?)

Mech · Oct 15, 2005

MrSmileyFaceDude said:
It just shows a message "{essential NPC name} is unconscious", whether you do it or someone/something else does.

I guess that means essential NPC's will sometimes get their asses kicked by other NPCs/creatures, nice!

Claw · Oct 15, 2005

MrSmileyFaceDude said:
Actually the auto reload thing is gone. NPCs marked as essential (a status which can and does change) now go "unconscious" for a period of time, then get back up again.

In other words, you can't kill anybody after all and Pete is talking bull.

If you reach Master (100) in a combat skill, you can do a particular power attack that has a CHANCE of temporarily paralyzing your opponent.

With any combat skill? Come on, you have to realize that is lame. It's great for blunt weapons, but a blade should have a different effect, like bleeding.

Yes, it's a die roll.

Sheer luck, or do stats affect the chance? A pure chance for a "crit" would be a pretty weak reward for mastery.

Infamy goes up every time you commit a crime, but never goes back down again.

Only if you are caught red-handed, I hope.

If an NPC or creature decides to flee, that's just what they'll do. It all depends on the situation & stats.

Some people overreact about this. Of course it does make sense to retreat and continue the fight later in some situations.

Revasser · Oct 15, 2005

Mech said:
MrSmileyFaceDude said:

It just shows a message "{essential NPC name} is unconscious", whether you do it or someone/something else does.

Click to expand...

I guess that means essential NPC's will sometimes get their asses kicked by other NPCs/creatures, nice!

Yeah, that's pretty good. Having the important NPCs as immortals (even if their immortal status is temporary with some of them) isn't great , but I have to say it's a damn sight better than that forced reload crap.

Pete Hines Audio Interview

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