KOTOR2 Early Review aka Bashings, Smashings, & Cursings

Okay, the title is kinda harsh; but meh. It deserves it... If you are a fanboy prepare to whine a lot or simply ignore the thread. If you are trying to be reasonable; you'll do this too. Only I can win this thread. Why? It's my review. SUCKERS! Anyways, selfdicking aside, here is my super duper mini review that covers Ebon Hawk/Peragus.

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee............


Graphics/Sound/Music: Let's start with the less important stuff first. Music is cool. Opening them is awesome; the rest is solid and probably even better than the original so far. Sounds is exactly the same. Graphics are a mixed bag - the backgrounds are seemingly uglier than the original though the characters do look better.

Main Story: WOW! This story is deep. People want you dead. Hahaha. You are the last remaining Jedi... but, you aren't a jedi or are you? And, the other Jedi aren't Jedi either. Whatever. As a side quest, this first part would be ok; but as the start of the game; it's just lame. Geez.. everyone knows you aren't the last jedi; but they pretend that's the case. Bah.

Murder Mystery: Though; the guilty party was obvious; it was still amusing to run around with your head cut off looking over the all the recordings.

Combat: *Yawn* Boring. Makes KOTOR1's combat seem like the hardest combat ever. It was easy plain, and simple. I died once, and that's only because I didn't bother using medpacs at all. ie. I got real lazy due to boredom. I hope the combat gets better and more varied.. and, no, the sith assassins don't cut it all. All they brought to the table was more experience and a chance to use stun. <>

Game Balance: I think the game forgot about this important aspect. The Item creation is utterly useless and unneeded. I used it once just for practice. Uograding using the work bench is still useful at least.

I already have tons of medpaks, mines, grenades, and verything else. And, oh, reaching level 8 in about 6 hours (and a good portion of that time wasting due to bugs) is piss poor. Even KOTOR, it was about 8 levels in about 12 hours. Impressive indeed!

While, later on, you'll see I like the skill useage in the game, balance with skills is ridiculous. As a Sentinel, I can pratically max out all availble skills with intelligence 14 - I imagine a Sentinel with 18+ intelligence being bored and annoyed that there isn't enough skills to waste their points on. Hell, even in NWN at level 40 with super intelligence you could never DREAM of maxing out your skill ranks. Bah.

Now, the feats are fun. Your character gets like half dozen free feats for either undescernible reasons (critical strike, power attack) or for bullshit make believe reasons ("War Veteran").

And, oh btw, there is no way according to your character's history, should you have been level 1. LAME! And, no, being unconcious for a bit is not enough. At least with Revan, you actually had a mind wipe.. unless I find out it was done this time too.

Dialogue: Ahh.. Something positive. Overall, the dialogue is solid. In some parts, it's very good. Alas, some of it just seems to be someone trying to write something 'deep' and it coming off wrong.

Skill Useage: Can't complain too much if at all. This is one of the main redeeming factors of the game. Awesome. Ability scores too.

Inconsistences: They're all over. One prime example is a convo with Kreia. Paraphrased it goes like this: "I'm not a Jedi"... "Don't be so sure about that. You are the last remaining Jedi." "But, I left the order." "But, the order never left you." ... a little while later in the same convo... "We must find other Jedi. They might be able to help" ... "They are no longer Jedi"

WTF? WTF? WTF? WTF? That isn't deep. That is convoluted, and plain old retardism.

Another piss poor thing is when leaving in Ebon Hawk you tell Atton to NOT blow up the asteroids as it might kill any remaining miners; but he does it (or something convuted happens) anyways. Whatever.

There are more examples; but I won't bug ya about them..

Characters: Main PC - So far fetched in it's whateverness. Half the time you get to choose your past; the other half someone has to tell you about yourself always with the exuse it's because of your 'concussion' that you forgot this valuable information. Whatever. The fact you start at level with no force powers; but "magically" have them returned to you at level 2 is just plain lame.

Kreia - Meh. This character is a mess. Another 'soul link. Woo hoo! The writing tries to make her seem intelligent and worldly; but she comes off fake and foolish and nonsenical. You want a real example of an intelligent oldster that imparts knowledge to the PC please see KOTOR1.

Atton - The same as Kreia. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. He makes Carth seem cool. However, I must admit two line sof his did make me laugh and/or smile. The best being: "Don't tell me I'm going to prison again!" R00fles! The line right after that was cool to. Otherwise, a completely useless character.

T3-M4: I like him/it. Not much more can be said then that. He's cool. He's funny. And, I love defending him when the two REAL idiots insult him. I mean, seriously, only idiots go out of their way to insult a droid. This guy is cool, and wayyyyyy better than he was in part one. Though; his "tagalog" workshop only gets half marks from me.. Overall, he si easily the best joinable npc of the three. Impressive considering I found him to be the 'worst"'in the original.

HK50 - Well, I'm a fool and I'm smart. I was smart because I realized within 1 second that he was responsible for what occured on the mining faculty. *yawn* I was stupid, however, 'cause for some reason I mistoke him for HK47. Geez.. And, here I thought that HK47 was an "unique" droid. Guess not. All HKs are EXACTLY like him. And, oh, when you call someone Master treat them as one. Still, overall, he was often funny and cool. Thumbs up.

Scion - Lame. Malak. Wannabe. Only uglier and some type of inhumane voice. Bah. Boring. Not gonna waste time discussing this dink.

Influence: It's good. Not as geat as some claim it is; but not as bad as I feared it would be. A nice addition to the game; but can be twinked.

Control: I'd like to control my character please. Half of my time should not be controlling another even if it's a cool droid.

Bugs: Muahaha. The Bug Man striketh. This game is buggy. Characetrs doing a funky dance non stop is not cool. NPCs standing around corners 5 'blocks' back is not cool. AI commands not working as commanded is NOT cool. When I tell Kreia to use her powers; you know, i'd like her to use her powers. R00fles! Good thing the game is easy. One good thing to say bug wise; I've experience zero actual crashes. That's a first for a game..

The Areas: Ebon Hawk/Tutorial - Perfectly. Acceptable. Tutorial. I'd put it on par with the originals' except for the fact you don't even control your actual character. Otherwise, cool. I did love the 'space walk' though.

Peragus - Eh. Some of it was nice - When you met Kreia as I actually thought she was ok; and the 'mine walk' again. I love wathcing the Harbinger docking and the old tapes of the deaders was alright. However, the actual action itself was simply boring. Yay. Walk down corrider after corrider destroying robots. Woopitydodah.

Harbinger - Same as Peragus; but it defines the word pointless. Simply boring, and Scion's appearance was just plain. I really wish him and Kreia simply had sex, had babies, ate them, then murdered each other while they were myseriosuly locked in that room/corrider. Bah. No such luck.

Telos - Really, really early here; but ti has potential. My biggest beef with this is the two calls you recieved right after the other. Talk about lameness. At least there won't be endless fighting here... I hope..

Overall. I dunno. It may seem i'm complaining a lot and I am; but the game isn't completely horrible. I'd rank it about where I'd rank NWN and TOEE (if TOEE wasn't so buggy either) if it wasn't buggy.The game, imo, will be a game that I will likely finish; but grudgingly so. Only because, there's *just* enough about it that I like to finish and unlike TOEE which had a wholly crappy story but great combat; KOTOR2 has crappy combat; but a solid story with good role-playing to keep me motivated.

Hopefully, it'll improve...


P.S. I'll likely do a "character" thread later. All you need to know is that I'm an 8th level Sentinel which super skills, and good stats (S10, D14, C12, I14, W14,C16).

Enjoy.


P.S.S. The above post *may* contain some spoilers. <>


R00fles!

Yay! KOTOR 2 reviews thread! I want to post one too!!!

Ok, here is my take. It may be harsh, but I can't compromise, so I'll tell you like it is:

There are 4 CDs. The installation process went smooth, although I did get one crash, but that was when I inserted CD#4 instead of CD#3. Anyway, like I said, the installation is solid. You get to see pretty pictures and listen to some nice music. Unfortunately, there were no role-playing opportunites during the installation process, which is kinda lame, because there is nothing else to do and I had to stare at the screen trying to see if there are any subliminal messages like "Buy Obsidian games! lolz". When the installation was finally over, my mom told me to start doing my homework, and I had to stop, so I don't have anything else to say. I will post more tomorrow. kthxbye.

Here'se mine.

I don't know why, but I bought this game. I iinstalled it, and created a character and it crashed. Then it crashed and crashed and crashed. Then I read 400 tips for getting it to work and spent 2 days installing various bastardized versions so that the game could crash in many different ways. Then I took it back.

Well it gets a fucking 10 for difficulty, but everything else is a 0.

And yes, this was on a laptop w/ an ATI card. My game machine blowed up after a glorious two years of service, and I can't buy a new machine until I buy a new bathroom.

jesus, now i'm damn glad i got it on Xbox. My home gaming rig runs on an ATI so i'd be fucked too.

*crosses fingers for a patch being released really soon*

"There are 4 CDs. The installation process went smooth, although I did get one crash, but that was when I inserted CD#4 instead of CD#3. Anyway, like I said, the installation is solid. You get to see pretty pictures and listen to some nice music. Unfortunately, there were no role-playing opportunites during the installation process, which is kinda lame, because there is nothing else to do and I had to stare at the screen trying to see if there are any subliminal messages like "Buy Obsidian games! lolz". When the installation was finally over, my mom told me to start doing my homework, and I had to stop, so I don't have anything else to say. I will post more tomorrow. kthxbye."

Ha.


"My home gaming rig runs on an ATI so i'd be fucked too."

Just use the 4.11 version. There's still bugs; but nowhere near as bad as it would otherwise. Now, it's just "BL bad". :D

Now, the feats are fun. Your character gets like half dozen free feats for either undescernible reasons (critical strike, power attack) or for bullshit make believe reasons ("War Veteran").

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I don't think the reasons are bullshit. Your character is a veteran of the Mandalorian Wars and he hasn't lost his memory or anything (except the Force thing). He still retains his fighting abilities.

Characters: Main PC - So far fetched in it's whateverness. Half the time you get to choose your past; the other half someone has to tell you about yourself always with the exuse it's because of your 'concussion' that you forgot this valuable information. Whatever. The fact you start at level with no force powers; but "magically" have them returned to you at level 2 is just plain lame.

Click to expand...

You've been severed from the force. Your link to Kreia has given you a link to the force. Your concussion didn't cause you to forget the valuable information, you were severed from it by the Jedi Order when you participated in the war they forbade you from participating in. The reason you get it back at level 2 is because of Kreia's presence, not because of anything else.

"I don't think the reasons are bullshit. Your character is a veteran of the Mandalorian Wars and he hasn't lost his memory or anything (except the Force thing). He still retains his fighting abilities."

That explains why he's level 1.

Well, that level 1 thing is pretty lame I admit, but it's there for gameplay purposes. The Kreia 'force chain' on the other hand is a very nice way to tell the story and explain why the character (you) is getting his powers back.

I don't think Atton is bad, either. I can tell he's attuned to the Force somehow, because of his 'gut feeling', and his ability to read people better than you do. He claims it's just something he picked up in his years as an adventurer, but it's probably more than that.

errorcode said:

jesus, now i'm damn glad i got it on Xbox. My home gaming rig runs on an ATI so i'd be fucked too.

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I run it on an ATI and the game plays without a hitch for me. I run on 5.x drivers and the game is smooth. The framerate isn't choppy like bloodlines or anything, either. In fact it runs just as well as KOTOR1 did.

"The Kreia 'force chain' on the other hand is a very nice way to tell the story and explain why the character (you) is getting his powers back."

Yeah, I do like that part. I like the fact that you can learn powers through playing the game and just chosing on level up. Though; it be nice if she didn't interrupt your thoughts during a fight. <> Combat may be pretty boring and simple; but still it's not like she'd have to wait long to talk to you.


"but it's there for gameplay purposes."

Yeah, I know. Doesn't mean I like it. However, the reason for all the bonus feats isn't really your past; but to 'banace' the game supposedly.


"don't think Atton is bad, either. I can tell he's attuned to the Force somehow, because of his 'gut feeling', and his ability to read people better than you do. He claims it's just something he picked up in his years as an adventurer, but it's probably more than that."

He's probably one of the npcs you can make into a Jedi.

Volourn said:

"I don't think the reasons are bullshit. Your character is a veteran of the Mandalorian Wars and he hasn't lost his memory or anything (except the Force thing). He still retains his fighting abilities."

That explains why he's level 1.

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That's why you're a level 1 JEDI, but they should have given you a few levels of a class of your preference from the first game(solider, scoundrel, etc.).

Main Story: WOW! This story is deep. People want you dead. Hahaha. You are the last remaining Jedi... but, you aren't a jedi or are you? And, the other Jedi aren't Jedi either. Whatever. As a side quest, this first part would be ok; but as the start of the game; it's just lame. Geez.. everyone knows you aren't the last jedi; but they pretend that's the case. Bah.

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I don't get the last remaining Jedi thing either. Supposedly the Sith assassins are trained to home in on Force Sensitive people, which means they ought to be able to find the other Jedi first, the ones who are probably still using the Force. I agree that the LAST JEDI EVAR thing is pretty silly considering Kreila is around you.

Game Balance: I think the game forgot about this important aspect. The Item creation is utterly useless and unneeded. I used it once just for practice. Uograding using the work bench is still useful at least.

Click to expand...

How much did you play with it? There's some pretty neat stuff you can make with it. However, I'm not so sure a linear game like KotOR2 is exactly the right place for such a thing.

Of course, making items is just another reason why the Jedi Guardian is a worseless class. They're really the only class that would probably WANT to wear armor, and naturally, they can't make it because of the skills thing.

While, later on, you'll see I like the skill useage in the game, balance with skills is ridiculous. As a Sentinel, I can pratically max out all availble skills with intelligence 14 - I imagine a Sentinel with 18+ intelligence being bored and annoyed that there isn't enough skills to waste their points on. Hell, even in NWN at level 40 with super intelligence you could never DREAM of maxing out your skill ranks. Bah.

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I tend to agree. The Sentinel is UBAR in this game. I'll admit my character can't fight very well - YET, but I can open anything the game will allow security to work on. I can talk my way out of anything where there is that option. I've got awareness maxed. I can hack anything with very few spikes required.

There really should be more skills in KotOR and KotOR2 than just the seven or eight it has. It would have allowed for more classes and would have prevented the sentinel from being so uber.

Now, the feats are fun. Your character gets like half dozen free feats for either undescernible reasons (critical strike, power attack) or for bullshit make believe reasons ("War Veteran").

Click to expand...

What's odd is you get unarmed feats automatically. Right now, I don't use weapons at all because I can do more damage with my character than I can with weapons. Then again, I'm a STR 10 sentinel, too.

Atton - The same as Kreia. Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. He makes Carth seem cool. However, I must admit two line sof his did make me laugh and/or smile. The best being: "Don't tell me I'm going to prison again!" R00fles! The line right after that was cool to. Otherwise, a completely useless character.

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I hated Carth. Atton is much better in my opinion. Carth was a whiny douche. Atton hasn't whined yet.

Saint_Proverbius said:

I don't get the last remaining Jedi thing either. Supposedly the Sith assassins are trained to home in on Force Sensitive people, which means they ought to be able to find the other Jedi first, the ones who are probably still using the Force. I agree that the LAST JEDI EVAR thing is pretty silly considering Kreila is around you.

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the other jedi are in hiding, "blending" in with various planets that have enough turmoil to mask their presense in the force. the exile, meanwhile, isnt hiding, thus hes easy to find.

as for kreia and why her presense isnt felt....that will be answered when you finish the game (or atleast it will give you an idea).

Kreia is no jedi, Saint. If your influence is good enough, you can ask her about it, and a movie will play.

Saint_Proverbius said:

Of course, making items is just another reason why the Jedi Guardian is a worseless class. They're really the only class that would probably WANT to wear armor, and naturally, they can't make it because of the skills thing.

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Incorrect. First, you can always bump your Int up a bit to have more points. Guardian doesn't mean that you should max out Str and ignore other stats. Second, Guardians get truckloads of feats. There are skill feats that remove cross-class penalties and skills increasing feats. Fourth, a lot of armor related items require awareness, treat injury, not repair. Also, there is no shortage of armor parts that one could find in the game.

Update: You only use your repair skill to break items. You can use your party members with proper skills to make items for you.

I hated Carth. Atton is much better in my opinion. Carth was a whiny douche. Atton hasn't whined yet

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No arguing here. Atton doesn't whine and any [spoiler alert!] Sith killer who specialized in killing Jedi [/spoiler] is a cool character by default.

"That's why you're a level 1 JEDI,"

Ha. Makes it even worse.


"How much did you play with it? There's some pretty neat stuff you can make with it. However, I'm not so sure a linear game like KotOR2 is exactly the right place for such a thing."

Yeah, it's not too bad now. Can actually be useful.


"What's odd is you get unarmed feats automatically. Right now, I don't use weapons at all because I can do more damage with my character than I can with weapons. Then again, I'm a STR 10 sentinel, too."

I'm a STR10 Sentinel too, and I still kick butt with a sword.


"Atton hasn't whined yet."

Yes, he does. Everytime I speak to him; he whines. Whines about pazaak, whines about beingc aptured, whines about me not moving quicker, whines about everything.


"the other jedi are in hiding, "blending" in with various planets that have enough turmoil to mask their presense in the force. the exile, meanwhile, isnt hiding, thus hes easy to find."

Oh please. The "Exile" hasn't even used his powers in years. He's even lost his connection so its silly for one to believe that they can sense the Exile's presecne through the Force; but not the others. Espicially since the Exile is NOT a Jedi. Lame.


"If your influence is good enough, you can ask her about it, and a movie will play."

Been there; done that. Neither is your character unles you decide to during the game. Afterall, youw ere exiled without your lightsabre and no force powers. Yet, everyone calls you a Jedi AND everyone knows you are a Jedi even though you arne't one and they all convinetly either don't mention the other Jedi or call them non Jedi. R00fles!


"No arguing here. Atton doesn't whine and any [spoiler alert!] Sith killer who specialized in killing Jedi [/spoiler] is a cool character by default."

Super spoilers rock in 'Early reviews' thread! Rock on! :D

Volourn said:

Super spoilers rock in 'Early reviews' thread! Rock on! :D

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Dude! I can't believe that you totally missed the spoilers tags! Anyway, now that you know who he was, isn't his fucking portrait fucking ridiculous for this "role"? He looks like a teen band singer, not a [spoiler - see above if you care].

Personally I think his voice is more inappropriate than his portrait.

Eh. Atton is just Atton. Meh. The fact that he is an assasin is just some silly attempt seemingly to make him "deeper" than he really is.

I'll take the Handmaiden anyday. It rocks when a HOT chick wants to be naked!

Too bad the KOTOR seeies is PG13 so she won't be really naked. <>

Volourn said:

I'll take the Handmaiden anyday. It rocks when a HOT chick wants to be naked!

Too bad the KOTOR seeies is PG13 so she won't be really naked. <>

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im sure someone will eventually make a naked mod for handmaiden.

Volourn said:

I'm a STR10 Sentinel too, and I still kick butt with a sword.

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I bet that with such statistics you could never beat all five handmaidens at the same time during that sparing fight in the polar base :wink: . BTW this was one of the two relatively hard battles I have encountered so far on maximum difficulty (I have just landed on Nar Shaddaa, looking for the first of the missing Jedi Masters). The other one was with that tank droid in the military base on Telos, but only because I hate to use grenades (it is not the Jedi style after all).

As to the other aspects of game, it really started to shine since my crashing on the polar plateau. The dialogue has become even better and more interesting characters have been introduced. Exactly when I thought that it is impossible to hate someone more than Kreia (I am steadily losing influence on her), and, voila, Atris walked in. Now, that’s a real bitch. Guess why Revan and Malak fled to the Dark side.

I intended to use Atton and Bao-Dur as my permanent followers because I don’t really like another melee/lightsaber fighter in my group, and they both look cool with blaster rifles (and yes, I will never admit any dual wielder to my party as it is simply not aesthetic). Now, thanks to the VD’s spoiler I have to leave Atton out because I don’t trust him anymore . This reminds me of my first PS: Torment experience, when I abandoned Morte because I believed that journal written by my paranoid alter ego.

I will appreciate any ideas regarding any possible replacement of Atton. I already listed my criteria: he/she must be a good range fighter and look cool with a RIFLE. And I prefer someone who is either following or is willing to turn to the Light Side. I was thinking of the Handmaiden, but she looks more like a Jedi wannabe. Plus I prefer her half-naked on the board of Ebon Hawk :twisted: . Alternatively, VD may swear that Atton will not betray me and then I will leave him in the party .

Oddly enough, Peragus was the portion of the game I enjoyed most. It felt more substantive than your average KOTOR dungeon.

To give Bioware some credit, I felt KOTOR, in general, had more interesting locations to explore. If Manaan was the least enjoyable planet in that game, I still prefer it to Nar Shadaa and the pos Korriban of this game.

Lomer said:

I intended to use Atton and Bao-Dur as my permanent followers... Now, thanks to the VD’s spoiler I have to leave Atton out because I don’t trust him anymore .

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I wouldn't have posted that if it was anything more than a background story. He's not some clevArly planted assassin waiting to strike your stupid ass down. I've just upgraded him into a Jedi, and he's happier than ever.

Vault Dweller said:

I wouldn't have posted that if it was anything more than a background story. He's not some clevArly planted assassin waiting to strike your stupid ass down. I've just upgraded him into a Jedi, and he's happier than ever.

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Thanks for the clarification, but I was just joking . I figured out from his dialogue with Kreia in the detentions cells that he is somewhat harmless now. I guess I will keep him in the active group for awhile, untill he becomes a Jedi. My ego just cannot stand another Jedi in the party .

I've just completed Peragus, and I've noticed these few rather irrelevant things:

1. On the spacewalk, the spacesuit equipped PC walked around three times faster than the similar sequence from KOTOR. I thought it was pretty funny that Obsidian would take note of this. Also the mine exhaust was not just a windowdressing as it damaged me actually.

2. It was pretty cool to see the turret mission actually leading to the Sith boarding the ship needed to be dispatched. It seemed more involved and consequential.

3. I like the way that the PC's ability to understand T3 was elaborated; I always wondered how the characters from the previous game could understand its beeps, it seemed as if that part of comprehension was chalked up to one of those facile assumptions in Star Wars.

4. The HK50 dialogues were just hilarious. I can appreciate the efforts that've gone into creating these.

5. The puzzle element of the game was not forced and well implemented so as not to frustrate too much. For example, I've written down the Turbolift code on paper before realizing that the game already understood the puzzle has been solved enough to take care of the solution. Perhaps that was related to the character's base intelligence, I'm not sure.

6. The Holologs were a step above the simple datalogs from KOTOR and more appealing and interesting to actually learn the history of what occurred.

7. Those same datapads can be deconstruted to base parts to build new items. I think it is a clever system that could minimize clutter.

8. Luckily, I did not experience the party becoming lost over AI mishaps. I've died once but that was because I disregarded Atton's advice how droids are ineffective with blasters at close range.

All in all, I think the game is a definite step above from the first one. I cannot wait to play it further, if it gets better as the plot progresses.