New interview

Vault Dweller · Nov 9, 2006

Spanish Clan DLAN site has expressed some interest in AoD and asked me a few questions about this and that.

The English version

The Spanish version comes with 3 screens showing the new lightmaps.

Higher Game · Nov 10, 2006

So you made it 3D so it wouldn't look dated? Sorry, but games without soil erosion look dated these days.

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

Well, there are different kinds of dated: NWN-dated, Diablo-dated, Spiderweb-dated, Wizardry1-dated.

Paranoid Jack · Nov 10, 2006

Fucked dated. If it has been out for six months or so it is most likely going to look dated to somebody/everybody to some extend. Sad but true.

So why do so many developers focus on having next gen graphics which will run smooth as silk with everything turned up to max settings but only on a video card that will be released in the next year or two?

Because shininess sells. Everyone knows that even the morons running the games industry. Not great design. Not great game-play. Not risk taking. Not breaking the mold.

That is why I hope to see some indie or low budget games make it huge. Like the indie movies that make it big and pull down huge box office sales. Because big sales opens the eyes of the greedy. And then maybe (just maybe, but I doubt it) some idiotic CEOs someplace will figure it out.

Make the damned game fun first off with loads of content and complex options. Add polish. Shoot for good (dated) graphics. Stop worrying so much about shit that has no impact after the first hour or so of game-play. If it has no longevity as far as game-play goes then don't focus the development teams effort on it.

Look at id ... think they would have learned that by now. But they keep depending too heavily on Carmack's newest engine to carry their games and their sales. Well, things evolve or they die. Game-design has to evolve or at the very least incorporate what was so great in all the old classics... make a game not a fucking tech demo.

Get real people to test it not some paid jackass with the bosses come dribbling down his chin. It just baffles me that so many poorly made games make it through design stage let alone testing. And nobody ever says, "Yeah, I had great fun for about ten hours. But then the super thin story, the shitting quest design and poor dialog options... not to mention the stupid AI (with the multiple personalities). Well all that shit started to bring me down. Now I keep asking myself, " why am I playing this again?" Oh, yeah. Because you are paying me to play it".

Ok, I know it's harder than all that but damn these mega developers with millions to spend on development should be able to come up with some better shit (games) than we have been given over the past few years.

/rant off (back to G3 and/or NWN2)

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

Paranoid Jack said:
Make the damned game fun first off with loads of content and complex options. Add polish. Shoot for good (dated) graphics. Stop worrying so much about shit that has no impact after the first hour or so of game-play. If it has no longevity as far as game-play goes then don't focus the development teams effort on it.

Prelude was a great, fantastic RPG. One of the best games to grace the RPG community in the last 5 years. Nobody wanted to buy it. Zero-Sum will not make another RPG again. Same goes for Arcanum. I believe I've made my point.

Xi · Nov 10, 2006

Nothing wrong with graphics. 3D graphics are the only way to go these days. Problems arise when most of the development time/costs are used to create extreme graphics and then the gameplay is marketed based off the look of the game.(Wtf?)

I think it makes sense to create moderate 3D graphics, nothing too fancy, which flesh out a certain level of immersion and cohesive believability within the world. Nothing wrong with 2D either, it's just that most people prefer 3D. It has nothign to do with dumbing anything down. No one would argue against graphics if a game had the best of both worlds, graphics and gameplay.

It's nice to see that it wasn't an afterthought and instead lands within the happy-medium. It does help regardless of how many people disagree. Graphics are important, just not as important as modern big-wig commercial development studios marketing schemes would lead us to believe.

Most folks tend to be visual by nature, so graphics will always be important up front. When you're in a bar having a beer odds are that you will pick out the big titted blonde practically every time. It's just first impression mind you, because she might be a real whore - though some folks like that, but I think it validates the graphical debate to some extent. We like things to be pretty because pretty is something desireable by nature.

AoD is looking good on both sides of the gameplay/graphics fence. Good to see interviews and information coming in. Nice read.

Kos_Koa · Nov 10, 2006

Those screens sure look purdy. Glad to see that you applied peopleâ€™s suggestions to the game regarding visuals, it definitely made a difference.

John Yossarian · Nov 10, 2006

P and I - How will the gameplay be?
Vince - Awesome!

I call hype.
Yeah and nice pictures.

Paranoid Jack · Nov 10, 2006

Vault Dweller said:
Paranoid Jack said:

Make the damned game fun first off with loads of content and complex options. Add polish. Shoot for good (dated) graphics. Stop worrying so much about shit that has no impact after the first hour or so of game-play. If it has no longevity as far as game-play goes then don't focus the development teams effort on it.

Click to expand...

Prelude was a great, fantastic RPG. One of the best games to grace the RPG community in the last 5 years. Nobody wanted to buy it. Zero-Sum will not make another RPG again. Same goes for Arcanum. I believe I've made my point.

VD, sorry if I made it seem as if that rant was directed at you or AoD. I was just letting off steam (I jammed/almost broke my little toe... the pain is making me grumpy). Anyway your comment about the graphics was the "key-word" that set me off. Mine was mainly a statement/opinion on game development in general. Xi, made his (and my point) much more eloquently. I think the choice you made for AoD was a wise one as far as the switch to 3D. But other studios (usually the big houses) just waste far too much time, money, and effort on graphics. And neglect other more important issues like solid game-play.

As far as Prelude goes... I tried to play it but it was too rough (crashing non-stop) at it's current state. I hear a previous build was much better but I never found it on-line.

And Arcanum lost a lot of buyers due to the dreaded fast "TURN-BASED" combat. Not to mention the speed needed to be tweaked to slow the characters down. Ranged combat was just a shot or two before the target was on you and you needed to switch to melee or die while trying to switch the melee. Yeah, you could pause it but the character movement speeds were just set to high.

Got to crash now, peace.

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

Paranoid Jack said:
VD, sorry if I made it seem as if that rant was directed at you or AoD.

I didn't think so.

Anyway your comment about the graphics was the "key-word" that set me off.

Well, the reality is that two best RPG companies of the last 5 years (Troika and Zero-Sum) are now out of business. Why? Because their games didn't sell enough. Why? Not pretty enough is the main reason. I remember the outcry when Arcanum was released. Most complaints were about the character models and the overly brown background. Who gives a shit about the role-playing qualities of the game when the background is too fucking brown? The sad truth is that the gamers are more responsible for the decline than the publishers. Had Troika's flagship title sold well, they would still be in business, and we would be playing Arcanum 2 right now.

See Xemous' post here for more details
http://rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php ... &start=150

Bah · Nov 10, 2006

Vault Dweller said:
Prelude was a great, fantastic RPG. One of the best games to grace the RPG community in the last 5 years. Nobody wanted to buy it. Zero-Sum will not make another RPG again. Same goes for Arcanum. I believe I've made my point.

I would still love to play Prelude. But it crashes my system about ever 15 minutes. And in such a way that I can't get my display back, and I'm forced to reboot. I have ZERO tolerance for buggy software and this is why I hestiate a LOT with indie games. If the game does not have a stable demo (or no demo at all) then I'm just not willing to buy it when it has a high possibility of being really really buggy.

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

Understandable. I'm not talking about "now", I'm talking about when the game was originally released, was stable and playable (see the 2003 discussions), and was actually sold for money, not given away as a freebie.

Monolith · Nov 10, 2006

Vault Dweller said:
Understandable. I'm not talking about "now", I'm talking about when the game was originally released, was stable and playable (see the 2003 discussions), and was actually sold for money, not given away as a freebie.

What, it wasn't buggy and unstable then? Besides, another major turn of is the choppy UI and mouse. At least that was reason enough to abandon it for many people who finally gave it a try after having been exposed to my extoltments for quite some time. I've never had a problem with that though and I'd willingly have paid for the game. Unfortunately, I didn't know anything about it when it was still "buyable"...

Btw, is the site with the interviews down or something?

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

Monolith said:
What, it wasn't buggy and unstable then?

Yep.

Btw, is the site with the interviews down or something?

It's slow.

Diogo Ribeiro · Nov 10, 2006

Nice interview.

Bit off topic but:

You enter the house. It's filled with scrolls, crates, and every imaginable gadget of varied useslessness.

I'm not sure of the in game context but, wouldn't it be safe to assume those gadgets do have a use but the character just can't fathom what they are? Of course, they can be utterly useless and I just don't know about it.

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

They are kinda useless, like most junk you see in antique stores these days. Valuable (for those who collect expensive old junk), but useless.

Frau Bishop · Nov 10, 2006

I like the interview, sometimes stupid answers for stupid questions are a good idea.
But talking about good.. the screenshots are not good. It's a pretty poor selection, they show mostly the 3d look of the game (not really great, not what the game is about, as I've been told) and nothing about dialogue, character sheet or anything else that would be a strength of the game. Although the "Another village idiot.. Must be my lucky day..." part made me chuckle.

Vault Dweller · Nov 10, 2006

A more indepth article on AoD's quest design showing a lot of screens is coming.

Paranoid Jack · Nov 11, 2006

Vault Dweller said:
A more indepth article on AoD's quest design showing a lot of screens is coming.

Sweet!

Vault Dweller said:
Well, the reality is that two best RPG companies of the last 5 years (Troika and Zero-Sum) are now out of business. Why? Because their games didn't sell enough. Why? Not pretty enough is the main reason.

VD, you could argue that that has always been the case. Even back when graphics went from plain old black and white to three colors. To some extent "shine" and later "hype" have always been the key to huge games sells. Just another part of the industry that has gotten farther out of hand as time progresses.

I think you mentioned how a decade (or even a few years ago) you could walk into a games store and find shelves or racks full or PC games. Now you are lucky to find one small section of your local EB or Gamestop devoted to PC titles. And they won't get anything new in (no new releases) unless somebody pre-orders that title. Of course big games with huge hype are stocked because palms are greased and shelf space is bought.

But in my eyes that is just as much a product of the retailers as the games industry and developers themselves. BestBuy sure seems to be doing ok with their larger section of PC games. They have more room for PC titles than all of the console space combined. So there is money to be made.

The biggest problem is that the safe money is in the old tried and true mold of shine shallow games with little to nothing new when compared to the older titles. Hell I would be over joyed if some developer just had the balls to pull all the good features from a half dozen great RPGs and use those features for their foundation and build a damned RPG that is original in story and setting. Something that doesn't have that been there done that feel.

Of course until I win the Mega-Lotto that just ain't going to happen... well unless Dragon Age is even worth a damn, then maybe.

Vault Dweller · Nov 11, 2006

Paranoid Jack said:
VD, you could argue that that has always been the case. Even back when graphics went from plain old black and white to three colors. To some extent "shine" and later "hype" have always been the key to huge games sells. Just another part of the industry that has gotten farther out of hand as time progresses.

That goes without saying, but I'm not bitching about the ever-improving graphics. I'm talking about the so-called fans of the genre turning their backs on the best games of the genre because the graphics are not up to the latest standards. That's killing the genre much faster than any stupidity a publisher can come up with.

Paranoid Jack · Nov 11, 2006

Vault Dweller said:
That goes without saying, but I'm not bitching about the ever-improving graphics. I'm talking about the so-called fans of the genre turning their backs on the best games of the genre because the graphics are not up to the latest standards. That's killing the genre much faster than any stupidity a publisher can come up with.

I agree. I know some people blindly buy games due to hype others due to fanboi faith in their favorite developer. But how many buy a game at least in part in an effort to assist the developers in staying afloat? I bought Kotor because I like Biowares other games but that still didn't help me to like the game. I think it was the Star Wars thing that killed it for me after that damn Lucas (JarJar Binks? aargh!) ruined the first three episodes.

Anyway I own more than half a dozen games from Naval. And at least two of them I bought fully knowing they would be less than what I was hoping for. But I still bought them grasping at the slightest chance that maybe the sales would help fund their next Silent Storm type project. I still have Hammer & Sickle sitting here unopened. I plan on playing it sooner or later... most likely much later, but you never know.

And I will admit I didn't buy Arcanum. I beta tested so after four or more runs through the opening part of the game I wasn't ready to go at it again. I bought something else... something new. And it's a good thing I didn't buy it because they shipped me a free copy as a thank you for beta testing.

I did buy Bloodlines on release day though I have yet to play it more than a dozen hours. I hear it has gotten much better with the community patches. Which is awesome of the guy doing most of the work.

Immortality · Nov 12, 2006

Well first off, I'd like to thank Vince fo the interview.

It was the first we made (after that one we've made 4 more to people from other independant and stablished studios - An interview with Rob Bartel from Bioware will come next in a week or so), and I'm glad with the outcome. In hope we can make the game known in the spanish community.

I personally think that the screenshots look way better than the first ones, and I'm also very happy that people at ITS accept criticism in such a good way and strive to achieve the quality the public is asking for.

So now lets hope Gothic 3 and NWN2 have some extra critical bug half way the main plot so the developers can go back to work in AoD *cough*

Now, I'm not sure if you'd be interested in next interviews to developers or not, but if you are you can stay tuned via RSS: http://foros.clandlan.net/index.php?act=rssout&id=7

Cruces · Nov 12, 2006

I would like to say shame on you VD for not mentioning you like Dark Sun, I am really disappointed and will now start crying.....soon.....sooon.....wait for it.....just one more moment.....there ya go you made me cry, happy now?

xemous · Nov 12, 2006

Well, the reality is that two best RPG companies of the last 5 years (Troika and Zero-Sum) are now out of business. Why? Because their games didn't sell enough. Why? Not pretty enough is the main reason.

I don't know how you're comparing Zero-Sum with Troika here, All of Troika's games looked good (therefore they went out of business for something other than graphics), Zero-Sums looked like shit, TOTAL OPPOSITES ON THE GRAPHICS

Balor · Nov 12, 2006

You say Arcanum looked good? It looked like shit. Not just because of 'brown' theme and the like... it's animations sucked, for instance.
Anyway, Fallout had much better graphics then Arcanum. Simple does not mean 'bad'.
Unfortunately, Arcanum's graphics was both simple AND bad, most of the time.

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